Reflection on Ancient Aliens
This blog has had its share of UFO and alien related blog posts. Though in all of them i have tried to demonstrate a Christian perspective, i have frankly had my fill of aliens and so-themed blogs for a while. So, this post is announcing my moratorium on blogs about UFOs, aliens and the like UNLESS i get a specific leading from the Lord. So who knows, there may be one next week. But i'm not planning any more for now.
That said, i wanted to maybe reflect on my experiences debunking Ancient Aliens. Though much of the work i've done on that doesn't really point back to Jesus directly, hopefully it shows that a follower of Jesus is dedicated to truth. The truth is that the ancient astronaut theory (and by proxy ancient high-technology theory) has been proven to be a lie.
My experience with ancient aliens goes back to my teenage years, and maybe further. Perhaps my whole life has been covered by its shadow. As a child i watched Star Wars ("long time ago, galaxy far far away) and Transformers (they are robotic aliens who crashed in prehistoric times) so the seed was always there. In my later years, it got me wondering if fact shared anything with fiction.
As a teen, i was introduced to the works of Erich von Daniken. I'm not sure how, i probably saw his books at the library. I've never been one to read a whole book from their, so i probably looked at the pictures and captions and bought into the ancient astronaut lie there. This was further reinforced through Fate magazine, the videogame Illusion of Gaia and numerous science fiction novels.
Into adulthood, even after becoming a Christian i recall reading a book on time travel which cemented the idea that there were OOPARTs (out of place artifacts) so the idea of time travel and/or ancient aliens was stuck even deeper.
However, once my faith had withered from 2004 - 2008 or somewhere in there, i repented and turned back to Jesus Christ and I re-learned that aliens were a demonic deception through Joe Jordan's, Rev. Radio and LA Marzulli's work among others but then what about these OOPARTs? Though there weren't aliens, i wondered if the ancients were merely super smart. Especially since some Christian theories allow ancient high-technology on account of fallen angels giving it to us or through nephilim-einsteins.
How else can we explain the pyramids, ancient structures (Baalbek) and clear proof of ancient flight? Nephilim and angels of course. Just swap out aliens for fallen angels/nephilim, and i can keep my comfortable world view of an ancient sci-fi world
Same lie, different cause.
After researching even just a few ancient alien claims in-depth, i've had to completely reject the entire concept of ancient high-technology. The evidence for AA is the same for high technology (from angels) and unfortunately the evidence is completely ridiculous.
I've found that all of the evidence for both theories to be at best, a misrepresentation or of a given event/evidence and at worst (and more often than not) a complete fabrication. Facts are taken out of context or embellished. Often they are just made up.
The saqqara bird and Tolima figures are completely taken out of context. The skyanchor stories are too, as they are contained right next to stories about sailors dropping knives in the sea only to land on their kitchen table back home.
Space suit figures shown on TV, when viewed from a different angle have skin showing and toes.
Meanwhile sitchin makes up his own translations and uses 25 year old plaster statues and von daniken use sci-fi magazine pictures as cave paintings.
Even worse, the theories and evidence contradict each other. Sure, aliens may need space suits to get through space (unless they've heard of pressurized ships like our space shuttle), but how is it they need one in our atmosphere? They don't breathe oxygen? OK, then how do they get their pants of do mate with human women? The whole point of a space suit is to protect the body.
And how many kinds of aliens supposedly have their fingers in our pie? Each theory proposes a new species, surely one ET experiment is already a stretch, the dozens or hundreds already out there make it even more so, especially when each one (or at least several) claim to have made us? Each individual Kachina of the Pueblo looks completely different, and those differ from the aliens in Egypt and so on and so on
They can't all have created us, and by the way. Who created the aliens?
So, with all of that said, the ancient alien theory offers no concrete answers merely half-truths and contradictions. It also offers no hope. After all, the aliens merely made us from apes to be a slave race. Great. If we're lucky enough to even have souls, then when we die all we have to look forward to is endless reincarnations. If we're lucky, we'll evolve to another rung on the ladder. Except the ladder is endless, and we are finite.
But the Bible on the other hand, tells us exactly where we come from and why we're screwed up. It also tells us how to fix the screw up - Jesus Christ. It also tells us exactly where we are going. And by the way, God's plan of redemption through Jesus Christ was foretold innumerable ways in the old testament, both through symbolism (covering nakedness with animal coverings, serpent in the wilderness) and encoded (the names of all of the patriarchs. Check out Chuck Missler's take on that) all CENTURIES before they happened.
Like atheism, the big bang theory, and evolution it takes more faith to believe in the ancient alien theory than it does to believe what it says in the Bible. The AA theory has proven itself wrong time and time again, or at best proven that there is a shadow of a doubt.
The Bible on the other hand has a proven track record across MILLENIA. To paraphrase Chuck Missler "66 books by 40 author written across centuries and yet there are consistant idioms and symbolism tying each book together.
Jesus Christ is the only hope for man kind, His Word, the Bible is the only possible explanation for what happened in the past and what will happen in the future.
Showing posts with label ancient aliens debunked. Show all posts
Showing posts with label ancient aliens debunked. Show all posts
Tuesday, June 26, 2012
Thursday, June 7, 2012
Caves of the Past: Ancient Aliens in Cave Paintings
In September, Ancient Aliens will be debunked. Here's the trailer:
http://conspiracyclothes.com/nowheretorun/video-only-ancient-aliens-debunked-trailer/
And here's some details on one of the claims being looked at in the film.
This particular post is just about cave paintings and rock art in general.
The key thing to note about virtually all artwork is that much of it is open to interpretation. No two interpretations are the same, nor are they all correct. Artists use symbols and colors to depict concepts and ideas making a given artwork mean something other than the obvious. The older the artwork and the further it is removed from its creator, the harder it would be to discern the symbols being used.
Ancient art found in caves or on rock faces is not so easy to break down. Some of it is highly strange to modern eyes and some would speculate that this is proof of ancient astronauts.
Ancient astronaut theorists use a variety of strange petroglyphs and cave paintings as proof of visitation by extraterrestrials in the far past. Rather than disproving each individual piece, or even the most famous pieces, it may be more productive to offer an explanation as to what people were trying to convey through their prehistoric graffiti.
It’s highly possible that all ancient artwork had at least a similar purpose, meaning or intent behind them. One researcher has found and documented a number of identical symbols that have appeared across a number of rock art sites over various spans of time. This suggests that all rock art originated from some common concepts and evolved their own meaning from there based on common symbolic origins.
“26 symbols have appeared repeatedly. These symbols appear in other parts of the world as well, leading to the possibility that symbolic communication through geometric signs arose with early humans. The diagram below shows regions around the world where the these 26 symbols have been found.”
http://www.bradshawfoundation.com/geometric_signs/geometric_signs.php
They also provide this interactive map on their Webpage which shows which symbols appear in each location.
Alien theorists though use slightly more complex pictures as proof of their alien visitations. This link provides some of the pictures that are used by alien theorists and many of these are strange enough to be considered “alien” by some, but could mean something else entirely.
http://www.bibleufo.com/anapetro1.htm
And here is perhaps the world’s largest image archive of rock art. Their purpose is preserving rock art and promoting study of it. They provide a small amount of analysis of the art, none of which has anything to do with ancient astronauts. They instead focus more on the artistic merits of the work. Unusual figures are referred to as figurative rather than aliens.
http://www.bradshawfoundation.com
What are cave paintings and petroglyphs really depicting though?
Certainly not every petroglyph or cave painting represents something that the artist saw or encountered. There are examples of that kind of art everywhere, but some of the more unusual rock pictures, rather than being aliens, could merely be symbols or an early attempt at writing.
“The artistic mastery shown in the rendering of the animals cannot be denied, but what about all the geometric signs that so often appear around or near the animals at the same sites?... I believe that the abstract nature of these signs is some of the best proof we currently have that these images were not being made purely for their aesthetic quality. It suggests a more symbolic role for these markings, and a desire to communicate ideas that were not necessarily easy to depict in a physical form.”
http://www.bradshawfoundation.com/geometric_signs/geometric_signs_france.php
Perhaps many of these images had some sort of context within their culture. That context may have given rise to symbols or ideas that have simply been lost forever.
“These images probably had deep cultural and religious significance for the societies that created them…Many petroglyphs are thought to represent some kind of not-yet-fully understood symbolic or ritual language. Later glyphs from the Nordic Bronze Age in Scandinavia seem to refer to some form of territorial boundary between tribes, in addition to possible religious meanings.”
http://www.experiencefestival.com/a/Petroglyph_-_Interpretation/id/5425289
(Emphasis added)
“Perhaps the greatest difficulty in getting at the meaning of prehistoric art is that we do not know the symbolic conceptions which were involved even in naturalistic representations. Are these to be taken literally, that is as signs? Or are they loaded symbols, part of a code to be broken?””
http://archaeology-easterndesert.com/html/rock_art_analysis.html
(Emphasis added)
In addition to the art containing symbols and concepts that were relevant to the culture in question, but have possibly been lost to the centuries, it’s entirely possible that today’s “experts” may be projecting modern ideas into the artwork. Considering this in the light of ancient astronaut theorists with books to sell and an axe to grind against Christianity and the Bible, it’s easy to see how present ideas of ancient aliens can be thrust upon art from long ago. Especially when the artist isn’t around to defend their position.
"However, it is all too easy for modern minds to have culturally determined ideas on ancient art that was produced by very different cultures and lifestyles. Ideologies and values of the modern onlooker may be very alien to those of the artists, and we have no way of knowing what types of image are purely representational or symbolic – and if symbolic, we have no access to the thought behind the symbols…Even the excellent Cyril Aldred, for example (1998) referred to Egyptian rock art as “magic-working rock drawings” (p.66). As Renfrew and Bahn point out, these theories were often speculative and some were undisciplined, and they were in danger of producing, ‘imagining’ what ancient people must have thought or believed” (2000 p.385)."
http://archaeology-easterndesert.com/html/rock_art_analysis.html
(Emphasis added)
Without a reasonably solid understanding of a given culture and what was important to them to inform us of what they were trying to communicate, understanding their cave and petroglyph artwork is made all the more harder. This of course opens wide the door for modern ideas like ancient astronauts to attach themselves to a piece of art.
A good example of this would be the gold figurines of the Tolima in South America. While most of these figures are obviously animals, some of these figures have odd features which make it hard to identify a specific animal. Ancient alien enthusiasts use these gold figures as proof of ancient flying machines provided by aliens. A deeper look however reveals that the “airplanes” are in all likelihood fish (flying fish, stingrays) that the Tolima encountered probably daily in the river. The river was a central fixture of Tolima life. Knowing about their livelihood and environment gives a context for their artwork that makes more sense than the modern idea being projected onto it. This principal can and should easily be applied to cave art and petroglyphs.
Looking at many of the petroglyph and painted figures depicted (http://www.bibleufo.com/anapetro1.htm) in ancient art through the new lens of lost symbolism and lost context should call into question their being proof of alien visitation. Exaggerated or contorted humanoids (people with “antennae” or non-human looking beings) may represent normal people with different skills or positions and even perhaps a message for travelers.
Another hypothesis is that what we think is ancient art may actually have been an ancient form of writing. And why not? That may certainly explain some of the more esoteric looking petroglyphs and cave paintings, the ones that look like aliens.
“It is important to remember that the intent behind what we now call "art" was, in all likelihood, not to create art at all.”
http://www.ancestral.com/meaning.html
Certainly, Chinese language started out as pictograms, that is pictures meant to convey a commonly understood idea, and evolved over time to what it is today. Using pictograms as writing makes a good deal of sense as it possibly lends itself to being interpreted properly by people of different languages and as a good foundation to build a written language from. Here are some examples of original Chinese pictograms, clearly depicting a recognizable idea, and their evolution to today’s writing.
http://www.ancientscripts.com/chinese.html
So if it wasn’t artwork, and it was writing of some sort, what does it mean? Although his views and interpretations are somewhat controversial amongst scholars, LaVan Martineau has possibly identified interpretations for a variety of rock/cave art. Interpretations that make a good deal more sense than the ancient astronaut theory. Martineau was an adopted Paiute Indian who learned a great deal from his time spent with the tribe. He was also a trained cryptographer for the United States Air Force. These two things should lend him some degree of credibility in deciphering Native American cryptograms.
“Martineau learned from the Paiutes that rock writing was based on many of the gestures used in Native American universal sign language. Sign language consisted of a few hundred gestures that could be combined together to communicate complex ideas between the various Native American tribes. Their spoken languages were so very different as to preclude any verbal communication, but the sign language was universal from the Paiutes of Utah, to the Pawnees of Nebraska or the Iroquois in New York.”
http://www.johnpratt.com/items/docs/lds/meridian/2006/petroglyphs.html
Some of his interpretations:
http://www.ancestral.com/meaning.html
This one is of particular interest. This pictogram is possibly directing the reader to the other side of a given boulder for some purpose.
http://www.ancestral.com/meaning.html
But it looks slightly similar to this Zuni petroglyph that is espoused as the body of an alien being. A directional marker would make far more sense than an ET visitor.
(photo taken directly of TV screen while watching Ancient Aliens)
Even pictographs of what look like aliens, actually may have a far more mundane meaning. These are reproductions of rock art said to be created by Native Americans in the area of Dalles, Oregon. It is not specified who made the interpretations.
http://www.ancestral.com/art/north_america/pacific_northwest.html
This petroglyph looks incredibly alien, yet a deeper analysis of it reveals something far less incredible.
“The petroglyph shows a man bent-over, signifying "old man", and without a belt or crotch line, signifying "poverty". The upper hand showing the palm at the same level as the heart signifies "good". The key to the meaning is given by the triangular symbol extending away from the buttocks.
Native American fisherman in the area had the custom of leaving their catch on the rocks so that those in need could take a fish to eat. Whenever someone came by, a fisherman who did not have any fish to spare would indicate this by slapping his buttocks loudly since speech could not be heard over the roar of the falls. The slap and gesture, however, were unmistakable. The individual would then move along without taking any fish. This practice is known because of historical records and oral tradition.
The reverse arrow on the petroglyph therefore signifies "please do not let those in need go hungry by slapping your buttocks". While two figures, that of an old man and that of a fisherman, would have been clearer, it would have taken twice as long to make the petroglyph. Shorthand, it appears, is particularly useful when the message must be carved into rock.”
http://www.ancestral.com/meaning.html
Martineau also suggested that some of the rock art is historical record. Even rock art that looks incredibly exotic may be merely a historical record of normal events. The use of symbolism makes this picture looks somewhat fantastical, but it is said to represent Kit Carson’s conquest of the Navajo. It’s doubtful that Carson or the Navajo employed horned giants in this episode. (not pictured, please follow the links)
http://www.johnpratt.com/items/docs/lds/meridian/2006/petroglyphs.html
And this one a war between different tribes over resources.
http://www.johnpratt.com/items/docs/lds/meridian/2006/petroglyphs.html
And some pictures held religious significance. This piece is interesting, because if one wanted to project an ancient astronaut viewpoint onto it, it would be quite easy. It looks enough like beings coming from the sky and coming to live on Earth. However, the opposite is true. This is a prophecy stone of the Hopi and it depicts the Creator leading the Hopi out of the ground and the possibility that the Hopi will be offered a chance to get onto the straight path for eternal life. When interpreted properly, this is an excellent “Mars Hill” moment to share the Gospel of Jesus Christ with the Hopi.
“Symbol a represents the Creator pointing down close to the ground from where the Hopi claim to have come. The short vertical lines near the Creator's hand b represent the Hopi people. The Creator is holding in his left hand "the life plan" or "trail" c upon which the Hopi are to embark. Near this hand is a circle d which represents "holding" of the entire continent in trust for the Creator, as he had instructed. (Since this photograph was taken, viewers of this panel have added a bow to the right hand of the Creator which was not apparent when Martineau surveyed the carving.)
Point e on the trail or life plan represents a time when it was predicted by the Creator that the Hopi would digress from the true path given to them and pursue another way. The square f is said to represent Oraibi, and the line or path g coming down from the square represents the false path of the wicked Oraibi . . .
The figures h standing upon the false path represent the wicked themselves. Older Hopi claim that heads have recently been added to these symbols, for they remember a time when no heads existed on these figures. The absence of heads would represent the punishment or death that the wicked must undergo as a result of following the false path.
The two zigzag lines I stemming from the false path represent the careless and different paths to permanent destruction pursued by the wicked. . . .
Symbol k is the true path of everlasting life, symbol l, which is shown at four points along this true path. The incorporation of the symbol old age (a cane) with life (a branching corn leaf) represents everlasting life. . . . The Hopi say that they are gourds which are shaken, thus representing three great wars or shakings that will transpire before the everlasting life is reached. The last circle represents the "final war" of purification in which all evil will be destroyed.
At point n on this panel the false path connects with an everlasting life symbol, showing that some may return to the true path and to everlasting life. The two zigzag lines which extend beyond this point of possible return to the path of everlasting life thus truly indicate permanent destruction, since the wicked have gone beyond this point of no return. Symbol o, at the end of the path is the great spirit holding an everlasting life symbol in his hand. He is shown waiting here at the end of the trail just as he was shown at the beginning of it. For this reason he is called the first and the last.[35”
http://www.johnpratt.com/items/docs/lds/meridian/2006/petroglyphs.html
It’s interesting to note that some of the Hopi mention that the above petroglyph had been changed even within their own lifetime. So in addition to the above concepts that we are dealing with, lost symbolism or some sort of sign language depicting directions, historical events and religious ideas, we must also consider that the pictures that we see on rock faces and in caves very well could have been changed since they were originally drawn.
The Wondjina (sometimes spelled differently, http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wondjina) are rain spirits of the Aborigine people. Obviously rain is highly important in the Australian outback. Of course, even though they are rain spirits, the Wondjina are sometimes alleged to be ancient aliens. Based on their appearance alone, this theory cannot be proven based on the current rock paintings.
“Testing at the Wandjina site showed some drawings had been repainted numerous times over, with the images evolving over time at the artists’ discretion, rendering the original artwork unknown"
http://listverse.com/2010/07/06/10-human-creations-attributed-to-aliens/
Indeed, the painting of the Wondjina every year has created layer upon layer of painting, and as the new portraits are added, no one can be sure what the originals looked like. What is certain is that the Aborigines do admit there are differences.
“Today, certain Aboriginal people of the Mowanjum tribes repaint the images to ensure the continuity of the Wondjina's presence.[2] Annual repainting in December or January also ensures the arrival of the monsoon rains, according to Mowanjum belief.[3] Repainting has occurred so often that at one site the paint is over 40 layers deep. The painting style evolves during this process: the figures of recent years are stockier and some now possess eyelashes.”
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wondjina
Small change after small change for who knows how many centuries and millenia could easily cause a wild departure from the original depictions, like a game of telephone. In any event, one wonders why aliens would demand their portrait be painted every year before sending life giving rain.
Added to the idea of constant revisionism over time is the presence of actual hoaxes and cherry-picked art pieces.
One of the most famous ancient astronaut rock paintings is a great example of this selective representation.
"The popular image of two “alien” figures in Val Camonica was picked out of over 200,000 drawings – a pretty clear sign of confirmation bias.”
http://listverse.com/2010/07/06/10-human-creations-attributed-to-aliens/
http://images.search.yahoo.com/images/view;_ylt=A0PDoKlmIbNPthUALOuJzbkF;_ylu=X3oDMTBlMTQ4cGxyBHNlYwNzcgRzbGsDaW1n?back=http%3A%2F%2Fimages.search.yahoo.com%2Fsearch%2Fimages%3Fp%3Dtwo%2Balien%2Bfigures%2Bin%2Bval%2Bcamonica%26fr%3Dytff1-yff80%26fr2%3Dpiv-web%26tab%3Dorganic%26ri%3D9&w=320&h=318&imgurl=elbohemio.files.wordpress.com%2F2009%2F04%2Fpaintings-from-val-camonica-italy.jpg%3Fw%3D450&rurl=http%3A%2F%2Felbohemio.wordpress.com%2F2009%2F04%2F08%2Falien-evidence-in-religious-art%2F&size=25+KB&name=paintings-from-val-camonica-italy&p=two+alien+figures+in+val+camonica&oid=f18c35e3dc181126e4a906e36e714db3&fr2=piv-web&fr=ytff1-yff80&tt=paintings-from-val-camonica-italy&b=0&ni=60&no=9&ts=&tab=organic&sigr=12a3ajpbv&sigb=13srovcp6&sigi=12hcs83po&.crumb=J29068lQMBu
And of course outright hoaxes. One hoax was perpetrated by none other than Erich “ancient aliens” von Daniken himself. He provides a piece of artwork, allegedly from a cave in Uzbekistan, as proof of ancient visitation both in his book Gold of the gods and his video of Chariots of the gods.
“It's a bit difficult to believe that von Däniken had no doubts about the painting at the time of publication, given that The Gold of the Gods carefully crops the image to hide the most ridiculous and obviously modern parts, and even reverses the image to obscure its origin…But von Däniken cared nothing for the evidence of hoaxing. Even more brazenly than in The Gold of the Gods, the complete image is reproduced… as figure 61 of the follow-up book later editions of Chariots and In Search of Ancient Astronauts: My Pictorial Evidence for the Impossible (1973; English version 1974)--even many years after von Däniken was alerted that the picture was not ancient. In the 1974 book, von Däniken again claims the painting is absolute proof that ancient people witnessed ancient astronauts.”
http://www.jasoncolavito.com/faking-ancient-art-in-uzbekistan.html
Indeed, the ancient alien crowd has falsified a good deal of evidence beyond cave paintings, some of which can be found here.
http://www.jasoncolavito.com/collection-ancient-alien-fraud.html
In looking at cave paintings and petroglyphs as proof ancient visitation by aliens, one is left with many other options to consider before jumping to conclusions about ET. Firstly, Ancient people were likely using symbolism that was relevant to them at the time, but symbolism (including, but not limited to religious) that has since lost its meaning. Second, and somewhat tied into the first idea, cave paintings and petroglyphs easily could have been a rudimentary form of writing to communicate across different spoken languages. There are some pieces that look like an odd creature, yet are actually communicating a complex idea that would have been known by the people who made it. There’s also the fact that rock art does not exist in a secure, sterile environment like a museum. As such, anyone could make changes in the large span of time between the art’s creation and now, thus obscuring the original image. And lastly, at least some ancient astronaut art has been fraudulently presented as evidence. When exposed as fraud, the ET theorists merely ignore the evidence. Viewed in light of these possibilities, the ancient astronaut theory is cast into serious doubt and as “Crazy-haired Georgio” likes to say about two independent “proofs,” “In any court of law, that’s evidence that would hold up.”
http://conspiracyclothes.com/nowheretorun/video-only-ancient-aliens-debunked-trailer/
And here's some details on one of the claims being looked at in the film.
This particular post is just about cave paintings and rock art in general.
The key thing to note about virtually all artwork is that much of it is open to interpretation. No two interpretations are the same, nor are they all correct. Artists use symbols and colors to depict concepts and ideas making a given artwork mean something other than the obvious. The older the artwork and the further it is removed from its creator, the harder it would be to discern the symbols being used.
Ancient art found in caves or on rock faces is not so easy to break down. Some of it is highly strange to modern eyes and some would speculate that this is proof of ancient astronauts.
Ancient astronaut theorists use a variety of strange petroglyphs and cave paintings as proof of visitation by extraterrestrials in the far past. Rather than disproving each individual piece, or even the most famous pieces, it may be more productive to offer an explanation as to what people were trying to convey through their prehistoric graffiti.
It’s highly possible that all ancient artwork had at least a similar purpose, meaning or intent behind them. One researcher has found and documented a number of identical symbols that have appeared across a number of rock art sites over various spans of time. This suggests that all rock art originated from some common concepts and evolved their own meaning from there based on common symbolic origins.
“26 symbols have appeared repeatedly. These symbols appear in other parts of the world as well, leading to the possibility that symbolic communication through geometric signs arose with early humans. The diagram below shows regions around the world where the these 26 symbols have been found.”
http://www.bradshawfoundation.com/geometric_signs/geometric_signs.php
They also provide this interactive map on their Webpage which shows which symbols appear in each location.
Alien theorists though use slightly more complex pictures as proof of their alien visitations. This link provides some of the pictures that are used by alien theorists and many of these are strange enough to be considered “alien” by some, but could mean something else entirely.
http://www.bibleufo.com/anapetro1.htm
And here is perhaps the world’s largest image archive of rock art. Their purpose is preserving rock art and promoting study of it. They provide a small amount of analysis of the art, none of which has anything to do with ancient astronauts. They instead focus more on the artistic merits of the work. Unusual figures are referred to as figurative rather than aliens.
http://www.bradshawfoundation.com
What are cave paintings and petroglyphs really depicting though?
Certainly not every petroglyph or cave painting represents something that the artist saw or encountered. There are examples of that kind of art everywhere, but some of the more unusual rock pictures, rather than being aliens, could merely be symbols or an early attempt at writing.
“The artistic mastery shown in the rendering of the animals cannot be denied, but what about all the geometric signs that so often appear around or near the animals at the same sites?... I believe that the abstract nature of these signs is some of the best proof we currently have that these images were not being made purely for their aesthetic quality. It suggests a more symbolic role for these markings, and a desire to communicate ideas that were not necessarily easy to depict in a physical form.”
http://www.bradshawfoundation.com/geometric_signs/geometric_signs_france.php
Perhaps many of these images had some sort of context within their culture. That context may have given rise to symbols or ideas that have simply been lost forever.
“These images probably had deep cultural and religious significance for the societies that created them…Many petroglyphs are thought to represent some kind of not-yet-fully understood symbolic or ritual language. Later glyphs from the Nordic Bronze Age in Scandinavia seem to refer to some form of territorial boundary between tribes, in addition to possible religious meanings.”
http://www.experiencefestival.com/a/Petroglyph_-_Interpretation/id/5425289
(Emphasis added)
“Perhaps the greatest difficulty in getting at the meaning of prehistoric art is that we do not know the symbolic conceptions which were involved even in naturalistic representations. Are these to be taken literally, that is as signs? Or are they loaded symbols, part of a code to be broken?””
http://archaeology-easterndesert.com/html/rock_art_analysis.html
(Emphasis added)
In addition to the art containing symbols and concepts that were relevant to the culture in question, but have possibly been lost to the centuries, it’s entirely possible that today’s “experts” may be projecting modern ideas into the artwork. Considering this in the light of ancient astronaut theorists with books to sell and an axe to grind against Christianity and the Bible, it’s easy to see how present ideas of ancient aliens can be thrust upon art from long ago. Especially when the artist isn’t around to defend their position.
"However, it is all too easy for modern minds to have culturally determined ideas on ancient art that was produced by very different cultures and lifestyles. Ideologies and values of the modern onlooker may be very alien to those of the artists, and we have no way of knowing what types of image are purely representational or symbolic – and if symbolic, we have no access to the thought behind the symbols…Even the excellent Cyril Aldred, for example (1998) referred to Egyptian rock art as “magic-working rock drawings” (p.66). As Renfrew and Bahn point out, these theories were often speculative and some were undisciplined, and they were in danger of producing, ‘imagining’ what ancient people must have thought or believed” (2000 p.385)."
http://archaeology-easterndesert.com/html/rock_art_analysis.html
(Emphasis added)
Without a reasonably solid understanding of a given culture and what was important to them to inform us of what they were trying to communicate, understanding their cave and petroglyph artwork is made all the more harder. This of course opens wide the door for modern ideas like ancient astronauts to attach themselves to a piece of art.
A good example of this would be the gold figurines of the Tolima in South America. While most of these figures are obviously animals, some of these figures have odd features which make it hard to identify a specific animal. Ancient alien enthusiasts use these gold figures as proof of ancient flying machines provided by aliens. A deeper look however reveals that the “airplanes” are in all likelihood fish (flying fish, stingrays) that the Tolima encountered probably daily in the river. The river was a central fixture of Tolima life. Knowing about their livelihood and environment gives a context for their artwork that makes more sense than the modern idea being projected onto it. This principal can and should easily be applied to cave art and petroglyphs.
Looking at many of the petroglyph and painted figures depicted (http://www.bibleufo.com/anapetro1.htm) in ancient art through the new lens of lost symbolism and lost context should call into question their being proof of alien visitation. Exaggerated or contorted humanoids (people with “antennae” or non-human looking beings) may represent normal people with different skills or positions and even perhaps a message for travelers.
Another hypothesis is that what we think is ancient art may actually have been an ancient form of writing. And why not? That may certainly explain some of the more esoteric looking petroglyphs and cave paintings, the ones that look like aliens.
“It is important to remember that the intent behind what we now call "art" was, in all likelihood, not to create art at all.”
http://www.ancestral.com/meaning.html
Certainly, Chinese language started out as pictograms, that is pictures meant to convey a commonly understood idea, and evolved over time to what it is today. Using pictograms as writing makes a good deal of sense as it possibly lends itself to being interpreted properly by people of different languages and as a good foundation to build a written language from. Here are some examples of original Chinese pictograms, clearly depicting a recognizable idea, and their evolution to today’s writing.
http://www.ancientscripts.com/chinese.html
So if it wasn’t artwork, and it was writing of some sort, what does it mean? Although his views and interpretations are somewhat controversial amongst scholars, LaVan Martineau has possibly identified interpretations for a variety of rock/cave art. Interpretations that make a good deal more sense than the ancient astronaut theory. Martineau was an adopted Paiute Indian who learned a great deal from his time spent with the tribe. He was also a trained cryptographer for the United States Air Force. These two things should lend him some degree of credibility in deciphering Native American cryptograms.
“Martineau learned from the Paiutes that rock writing was based on many of the gestures used in Native American universal sign language. Sign language consisted of a few hundred gestures that could be combined together to communicate complex ideas between the various Native American tribes. Their spoken languages were so very different as to preclude any verbal communication, but the sign language was universal from the Paiutes of Utah, to the Pawnees of Nebraska or the Iroquois in New York.”
http://www.johnpratt.com/items/docs/lds/meridian/2006/petroglyphs.html
Some of his interpretations:
http://www.ancestral.com/meaning.html
This one is of particular interest. This pictogram is possibly directing the reader to the other side of a given boulder for some purpose.
http://www.ancestral.com/meaning.html
But it looks slightly similar to this Zuni petroglyph that is espoused as the body of an alien being. A directional marker would make far more sense than an ET visitor.
(photo taken directly of TV screen while watching Ancient Aliens)
Even pictographs of what look like aliens, actually may have a far more mundane meaning. These are reproductions of rock art said to be created by Native Americans in the area of Dalles, Oregon. It is not specified who made the interpretations.
http://www.ancestral.com/art/north_america/pacific_northwest.html
This petroglyph looks incredibly alien, yet a deeper analysis of it reveals something far less incredible.
“The petroglyph shows a man bent-over, signifying "old man", and without a belt or crotch line, signifying "poverty". The upper hand showing the palm at the same level as the heart signifies "good". The key to the meaning is given by the triangular symbol extending away from the buttocks.
Native American fisherman in the area had the custom of leaving their catch on the rocks so that those in need could take a fish to eat. Whenever someone came by, a fisherman who did not have any fish to spare would indicate this by slapping his buttocks loudly since speech could not be heard over the roar of the falls. The slap and gesture, however, were unmistakable. The individual would then move along without taking any fish. This practice is known because of historical records and oral tradition.
The reverse arrow on the petroglyph therefore signifies "please do not let those in need go hungry by slapping your buttocks". While two figures, that of an old man and that of a fisherman, would have been clearer, it would have taken twice as long to make the petroglyph. Shorthand, it appears, is particularly useful when the message must be carved into rock.”
http://www.ancestral.com/meaning.html
Martineau also suggested that some of the rock art is historical record. Even rock art that looks incredibly exotic may be merely a historical record of normal events. The use of symbolism makes this picture looks somewhat fantastical, but it is said to represent Kit Carson’s conquest of the Navajo. It’s doubtful that Carson or the Navajo employed horned giants in this episode. (not pictured, please follow the links)
http://www.johnpratt.com/items/docs/lds/meridian/2006/petroglyphs.html
And this one a war between different tribes over resources.
http://www.johnpratt.com/items/docs/lds/meridian/2006/petroglyphs.html
And some pictures held religious significance. This piece is interesting, because if one wanted to project an ancient astronaut viewpoint onto it, it would be quite easy. It looks enough like beings coming from the sky and coming to live on Earth. However, the opposite is true. This is a prophecy stone of the Hopi and it depicts the Creator leading the Hopi out of the ground and the possibility that the Hopi will be offered a chance to get onto the straight path for eternal life. When interpreted properly, this is an excellent “Mars Hill” moment to share the Gospel of Jesus Christ with the Hopi.
“Symbol a represents the Creator pointing down close to the ground from where the Hopi claim to have come. The short vertical lines near the Creator's hand b represent the Hopi people. The Creator is holding in his left hand "the life plan" or "trail" c upon which the Hopi are to embark. Near this hand is a circle d which represents "holding" of the entire continent in trust for the Creator, as he had instructed. (Since this photograph was taken, viewers of this panel have added a bow to the right hand of the Creator which was not apparent when Martineau surveyed the carving.)
Point e on the trail or life plan represents a time when it was predicted by the Creator that the Hopi would digress from the true path given to them and pursue another way. The square f is said to represent Oraibi, and the line or path g coming down from the square represents the false path of the wicked Oraibi . . .
The figures h standing upon the false path represent the wicked themselves. Older Hopi claim that heads have recently been added to these symbols, for they remember a time when no heads existed on these figures. The absence of heads would represent the punishment or death that the wicked must undergo as a result of following the false path.
The two zigzag lines I stemming from the false path represent the careless and different paths to permanent destruction pursued by the wicked. . . .
Symbol k is the true path of everlasting life, symbol l, which is shown at four points along this true path. The incorporation of the symbol old age (a cane) with life (a branching corn leaf) represents everlasting life. . . . The Hopi say that they are gourds which are shaken, thus representing three great wars or shakings that will transpire before the everlasting life is reached. The last circle represents the "final war" of purification in which all evil will be destroyed.
At point n on this panel the false path connects with an everlasting life symbol, showing that some may return to the true path and to everlasting life. The two zigzag lines which extend beyond this point of possible return to the path of everlasting life thus truly indicate permanent destruction, since the wicked have gone beyond this point of no return. Symbol o, at the end of the path is the great spirit holding an everlasting life symbol in his hand. He is shown waiting here at the end of the trail just as he was shown at the beginning of it. For this reason he is called the first and the last.[35”
http://www.johnpratt.com/items/docs/lds/meridian/2006/petroglyphs.html
It’s interesting to note that some of the Hopi mention that the above petroglyph had been changed even within their own lifetime. So in addition to the above concepts that we are dealing with, lost symbolism or some sort of sign language depicting directions, historical events and religious ideas, we must also consider that the pictures that we see on rock faces and in caves very well could have been changed since they were originally drawn.
The Wondjina (sometimes spelled differently, http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wondjina) are rain spirits of the Aborigine people. Obviously rain is highly important in the Australian outback. Of course, even though they are rain spirits, the Wondjina are sometimes alleged to be ancient aliens. Based on their appearance alone, this theory cannot be proven based on the current rock paintings.
“Testing at the Wandjina site showed some drawings had been repainted numerous times over, with the images evolving over time at the artists’ discretion, rendering the original artwork unknown"
http://listverse.com/2010/07/06/10-human-creations-attributed-to-aliens/
Indeed, the painting of the Wondjina every year has created layer upon layer of painting, and as the new portraits are added, no one can be sure what the originals looked like. What is certain is that the Aborigines do admit there are differences.
“Today, certain Aboriginal people of the Mowanjum tribes repaint the images to ensure the continuity of the Wondjina's presence.[2] Annual repainting in December or January also ensures the arrival of the monsoon rains, according to Mowanjum belief.[3] Repainting has occurred so often that at one site the paint is over 40 layers deep. The painting style evolves during this process: the figures of recent years are stockier and some now possess eyelashes.”
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wondjina
Small change after small change for who knows how many centuries and millenia could easily cause a wild departure from the original depictions, like a game of telephone. In any event, one wonders why aliens would demand their portrait be painted every year before sending life giving rain.
Added to the idea of constant revisionism over time is the presence of actual hoaxes and cherry-picked art pieces.
One of the most famous ancient astronaut rock paintings is a great example of this selective representation.
"The popular image of two “alien” figures in Val Camonica was picked out of over 200,000 drawings – a pretty clear sign of confirmation bias.”
http://listverse.com/2010/07/06/10-human-creations-attributed-to-aliens/
http://images.search.yahoo.com/images/view;_ylt=A0PDoKlmIbNPthUALOuJzbkF;_ylu=X3oDMTBlMTQ4cGxyBHNlYwNzcgRzbGsDaW1n?back=http%3A%2F%2Fimages.search.yahoo.com%2Fsearch%2Fimages%3Fp%3Dtwo%2Balien%2Bfigures%2Bin%2Bval%2Bcamonica%26fr%3Dytff1-yff80%26fr2%3Dpiv-web%26tab%3Dorganic%26ri%3D9&w=320&h=318&imgurl=elbohemio.files.wordpress.com%2F2009%2F04%2Fpaintings-from-val-camonica-italy.jpg%3Fw%3D450&rurl=http%3A%2F%2Felbohemio.wordpress.com%2F2009%2F04%2F08%2Falien-evidence-in-religious-art%2F&size=25+KB&name=paintings-from-val-camonica-italy&p=two+alien+figures+in+val+camonica&oid=f18c35e3dc181126e4a906e36e714db3&fr2=piv-web&fr=ytff1-yff80&tt=paintings-from-val-camonica-italy&b=0&ni=60&no=9&ts=&tab=organic&sigr=12a3ajpbv&sigb=13srovcp6&sigi=12hcs83po&.crumb=J29068lQMBu
And of course outright hoaxes. One hoax was perpetrated by none other than Erich “ancient aliens” von Daniken himself. He provides a piece of artwork, allegedly from a cave in Uzbekistan, as proof of ancient visitation both in his book Gold of the gods and his video of Chariots of the gods.
“It's a bit difficult to believe that von Däniken had no doubts about the painting at the time of publication, given that The Gold of the Gods carefully crops the image to hide the most ridiculous and obviously modern parts, and even reverses the image to obscure its origin…But von Däniken cared nothing for the evidence of hoaxing. Even more brazenly than in The Gold of the Gods, the complete image is reproduced… as figure 61 of the follow-up book later editions of Chariots and In Search of Ancient Astronauts: My Pictorial Evidence for the Impossible (1973; English version 1974)--even many years after von Däniken was alerted that the picture was not ancient. In the 1974 book, von Däniken again claims the painting is absolute proof that ancient people witnessed ancient astronauts.”
http://www.jasoncolavito.com/faking-ancient-art-in-uzbekistan.html
Indeed, the ancient alien crowd has falsified a good deal of evidence beyond cave paintings, some of which can be found here.
http://www.jasoncolavito.com/collection-ancient-alien-fraud.html
In looking at cave paintings and petroglyphs as proof ancient visitation by aliens, one is left with many other options to consider before jumping to conclusions about ET. Firstly, Ancient people were likely using symbolism that was relevant to them at the time, but symbolism (including, but not limited to religious) that has since lost its meaning. Second, and somewhat tied into the first idea, cave paintings and petroglyphs easily could have been a rudimentary form of writing to communicate across different spoken languages. There are some pieces that look like an odd creature, yet are actually communicating a complex idea that would have been known by the people who made it. There’s also the fact that rock art does not exist in a secure, sterile environment like a museum. As such, anyone could make changes in the large span of time between the art’s creation and now, thus obscuring the original image. And lastly, at least some ancient astronaut art has been fraudulently presented as evidence. When exposed as fraud, the ET theorists merely ignore the evidence. Viewed in light of these possibilities, the ancient astronaut theory is cast into serious doubt and as “Crazy-haired Georgio” likes to say about two independent “proofs,” “In any court of law, that’s evidence that would hold up.”
Ahhh, The Old Ancient Space Suit Trick
Claim:
Georgio:
Why would ancient astronauts have to wear an astronaut suit that we’re familiar with today? The answer is very simple. Can we go through space without wearing a type of suit? Of course not, we would die. Because, who says that whoever visited us in the remote past that they could breathe in the atmosphere of planet earth? It’s not farfetched to suggest that they did in fact wear some type of suit.
Narrator: Why might these images resemble modern astronauts? If they are aliens, is it possible that they are similar to humans? Could they have come from a planet just like Earth?
Refutation
If the aliens required a suit to be on our planet, one wonders how the stories of “alien visitors” mating with human women worked out. In the Ancient Aliens show, it is claimed that the visitors are like us. If they are, again why the need for a suit?
Ancient astronaut theorists use artwork from the past as proof that aliens have visited earth in the past. Often times, they use cave paintings and petroglyphs which have many interpretations that should be considered before entertaining the thought of aliens. Aside from that “evidence” alien theorists also use statues as proof.
Turkey
One such statue, pictured below, was alleged to be a three thousand year old statue depicting a rocket man. It was claimed by Zechariah Sitchin (who has been sufficiently discredited via www.sitchiniswrong.com) that it depicted a “pilot as sitting with legs folded toward his chest, and wearing a one-piece "ribbed pressure suit" which becomes boots at the feet, and gloves at the hands, and points out that since the pilot’s head is missing, we cannot know whether the pilot wore a helmet, goggles, or other headgear.”
http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/sitchin/esp_sitchin_13.htm
http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/sitchin/esp_sitchin_13.htm
Despite its supposed age, evidence to the contrary of its ancient origins has surfaced.
“It became evident that the alleged three thousand year old Space Module that was hosted by the Archaeological Museum of Istanbul was in actuality made from plaster 25 years ago…But conclusions of the Ministry of Arts and Culture Memorial and Museums department chemical and petro-graphical analyses proved that those theories didn’t agree with historical reality…The General Director of the Museum Ph. D. Alpay Pasinli said that, the artifact could not be from three thousand years, but rather from 25 years the most.”
http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/sitchin/esp_sitchin_28.htm
A post by Elirien on the Project Avalon forum serves as the origin of the above quote. Here is Elirien’s post in its entirety.
“The three thousand year old space module was 25 year old plaster!
It became evident that The alleged three thousand year old Space Module that was hosted by the Archaeological Museum of Istanbul was in actuality made from plaster 25 years ago.
The space module which was found “matchless” by museum curators, found as a three thousand year old space module of the Urartu Kingdom many headlines to news in the western press. But conclusions of the Ministry of Arts and Culture Memorial and Museums department chemical and petro-graphical analyses proved that those theories didn’t agree with historical reality.
There is various and contradicting information concerning how the artifact came to the museum. One of the theories is that an antique merchant brought it to the museum. The space module, which has five engines is 23 centimeters long and 9,5 centimeters high. The General Director of the Museum Ph. D. Alpay Pasinli said that, the artifact could not be from three thousand years, but rather from 25 years the most. Pasinli, who said that we should remember that the western press convinced their public that the space module was three thousand years old, added that they have confirmed that this artifact was made out of plaster and marble dust through the results from analyses.
The space module, which became one of the most popular artifacts of the Istanbul Archeological Museum and was sought after by western scientists and media, was written about in tens of Articles in Europe and became news in many newspapers and television news casts. The space module which was sought after by German and English archeologists in the beginning of the 1990’s was for a long time secured in the preservation unit of the museum. The first who succeeded in photographing the space module was the English Magazine “Fortean Times”. The Magazine, which showed a picture of the sculpture and head lined “Is it an ancient space module?” in their October 1993 issue was followed by the German magazine “Magazin 2000”. After this event the competing firm of Magazin 2000, G.A.R.L. sent their editor to Istanbul and he shared his findings with the public. But almost all of the research and what was presented to the public was written in this manner: “It is confirmed that the space ship that is now in the Istanbul Archeological Museum was found in a archeological dig made in 1975 in the old city of Tuspa that is also known as Toprakkale. It is in the northeast of the Van lake where the Urartu Kingdom spread between 830-612 BC.” After these allegations were made it was written that it was in the Istanbul Archeological Museum but not on public display.
Zecharia Sitchin, linguistic and Bible scholar and writer of the book “The 12th Planet”, made the greatest research on the controversial “Space Module”. Sitchin, who came in the beginning of the 90’s to Turkey came in the forefront of the people that claimed that the Space Module was three thousand years old. Sitchin made these remarks after the sculpture left the preservation unit of the museum and was presented to him on a velvet tray: “The object, was made out of a porous material that could probably be a stone made out of volcanic ash. The bends and amazing amount of detail disproves that it was made from raw labor. Was it really a plaster caste that came out of a plastic toy as claimed by the museums official explanations? It doesn’t seem that way.
There are various and contradicting information concerning how and from where the “Space Module” was brought to the Istanbul Archeological Museum. The most popular idea is that an antique trader brought the sculpture and after realizing that it was fake he didn’t pursue it. The Space module which is 23 centimeters long, 9,5 centimeters high and 8 centimeters wide has five engines. There is also a pilot figure on the small sculpture that has bent his knees reaching its chest. The clothing of the pilot resembles the space suits that astronauts wear.
source: http://arsiv.zaman.com.tr/2003/04/30/kultur/h6.htm (in turkish though, I translated it).”
http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=5976&page=3
And here is the text from Zaman.com translated via Google translate. It seems to be the same text that Elirien posted on the forum.
“Three thousand year old space module 'alçıymış 25 years!
Istanbul Archaeological Museum, and three thousand years in the alleged 'Space Module, plaster, made 25 years ago emerged.
Curators 'unique' which he described as a spacecraft, the Western media 'Urartians spacecraft belonging to three thousand years' title was subject to numerous news. However, the Ministry of Culture commissioned by the Directorate General of Monuments and Museums, as a result of chemical and petrographic analyzes, these views are inconsistent with the historical facts understood.
There are conflicting accounts about where it came from the work to the museum. Module according to one of these views has brought to the museum an antique dealer. 23 cm long and 9.5 cm high, the space module has 5 engine. Director General of Monuments and Museums, Dr. Alpay Pasinli of the work, three thousand years ago, but that he might have made more than 25 years ago. Western scientists wrote articles and writings he promotes his own public opinion reminiscent of the space module Pasinli three thousand years, "Reviews of plaster and marble dust as a result of this work have been generated." He said.
Istanbul Archaeological Museum, which is one of the most popular, and the median Western scientists will pursue to see 'Space Module' in Europe to date related to the article published in dozens, many newspapers and television news. To see themselves in pursuit of the German and British archaeologists in the early 1990s' Space Module ', a long time the Istanbul Archaeological Museums' department of housing was kept hidden. 'Space Module Fortean Times magazine, the British had succeeded in the first viewing. October 1993 along with a photograph of the statue in the number of "Old Is A Space Module?" The title of the magazine who, in 1994 the German magazine 'Magazine 2000' was followed. 'Rival broadcaster Magazine 2000' WITH LAUREL 'after this incident, the editor sent to Istanbul. He reached as a result of the research information shared with his readers. But emerging and Western public opinion is reflected in almost every survey information as follows: "stored in the Istanbul Archaeological Museum spacecraft, now known as the former Tuşpa Toprakkale located in the city in 1975, is confirmed by the excavations of the ordinary. BC It BC 830'dan Dispersed up to 612 of the Urartu civilization in the northeast of Lake Van. "After giving the information in the form of" this extraordinary object, now the Archaeological Museum in Istanbul, but sergilenmemektedir. "Was called.
Controversial 'Space Module' makes the most extensive research and Bible scholar, linguist, '12. Planet ', the author Zecharia Sitchin'di. Sitchin came to Turkey in the early 1990s, 'Space Module, believing that the 3000 year was one of the names. Sitchin, the museum 'housing removed from the Department,' velvet tray in the 'sculpture shown to him had made determinations regarding the following: "The object, presumably consisting of a volcanic ash porous stone that may be made of a substance. Accordance with amazing curves and other details are also refutes the idea that it is a crude product of labor. Removed from the official descriptions of the museum, such as a plaster mold with a plastic toy did? It does not appear at all. "
'Space Module into the Istanbul Archaeological Museum where it came from and how it is in the contradictory opinions. According to the most common opinion, the seller brought an antique statue, and one more on the pursuit of understanding does not fall into being a fake. 23 cm long, 9.5 cm high, 8 cm wide, the 'Space Module'' of the five engines. Heykelcikte, legs curled up toward the chest as a pilot figure is also a sitting. Clothes worn by the pilot of the 'space suit worn by astronot'ların resembles.
Abdullah Kilic / Istanbul”
Unfortunately for Sitchin and the ancient astronaut crowd, the reality of the rocket man statue is that it is unable to hold up to serious scrutiny.
Japan
Another set of statues purported to be a depiction of an ancient astronaut. The Dogu statues of Japan. (http://www.e-yakimono.net/html/jomon-dogu.html) Dogu come in many styles, but the “slitted-goggles” (pictured below) variety are arguably the most famous. Many of them are unusual to be sure, but not all of them look like aliens. Additionally, besides an alien explanation, a more plausible theory has been given for at least some of the figures.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dog%C5%AB
And a few dogu that are obviously stylized people, and widely ignored by ancient aliens folks.
http://www.e-yakimono.net/html/jomon-dogu.html
A user on abovetopsecret (http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread544923/pg1) has cleverly discovered that the Dogu pictured above may actually be a stylized version of one of the Inuit people. The eyes are actually said to be Inuit snow goggles and the puffy “space suit” is actually winter attire.
http://anthromuseum.missouri.edu/archiveaids/cordle.shtml
http://www.sinc.stonybrook.edu/Clubs/socia/web_items/old_website/
It’s not completely unfeasible that the Japanese could have encountered Inuit people in the distant past. Certainly it’s more believable than aliens from light years away. There’s evidence to suggest that some Japanese or elements of their culture made it as far as New Mexico, so encountering . The language of the Zuni people in New Mexico may be a variant of Japanese suggesting some relation between the two cultures. After all, the Native Americans had to come from somewhere and it’s commonly accepted theory that they traveled from Asia across the Bering land bridge.
“The Zuni Enigma, by Nancy Yaw Davis offers a comparative of cognates between the Zuni language and another language isolate; the Japanese language. While speculative… it demonstrates a likeness between the Zuni and Japanese languages that may be more compelling than that of the Penutian Hypothesis.”
http://www.amerindianarts.us/articles/zuni_language.shtml
“For example, the Zuni word for "clan" is "kwe," while in Japanese it is "kwai." The word for "clown" is "newe" in Japanese and "niwaka" in Zuni. "Priest" is "shawani" in Japanese and "shiwani" in Zuni…And then there was the whole syntax thing -- both languages use the verb as the last word of a sentence, a feature only 45 percent of languages share.”
http://www.cracked.com/article_19769_5-baffling-discoveries-that-prove-history-books-are-wrong_p2.html
And other evidence is available here:
http://www.science-frontiers.com/sf087/sf087a02.htm
Ecuador
In Cuenca, Ecuador a number of artifacts have been found, most of which were presented to Father Carlos Crespi, Catholic priest/missionary to the Native people of that area. Many of these are metal work, gold, brass and the like. Among the many artifacts given to him by the Natives, often in exchange for money, were figures that appeared in the Ancient Aliens shows. This one was displayed quite prominently, and from the vantage point it was shown does indeed look like a space suit.
screenshot of Ancient Aliens
Apparently the History Channel's penchant for deception still applies here. Here is the same “space suit” seen from a whole body angle.
Notice that this figure has toes that are not protected by the “suit,” in addition to a large amount of what appears to be exposed skin. So if it is a suit, it isn’t going to keep the astronaut alive for very long.
http://aenigmaunveiled.wordpress.com/2011/04/20/ufo-in-prehistoric-art-i/
The below figure, also said to be evidence of an ancient space suit has the same exact problem in addition to missing his face plate.
http://aenigmaunveiled.wordpress.com/2011/04/20/ufo-in-prehistoric-art-i/
There is little to no information available about this statue, or most such figures outside of the connection to the ancient astronaut theory. The only other information that comes up for these two figures is that they are from Cuenca, Ecuador and in all likelihood part of the collection of Father Carlos Crespi. Crespi was a missionary (sometimes rumored to be Hitler in disguise) on assignment from the Vatican and he often took in artifacts found by the native people in exchange for money. He was known to purchase fake artwork from the Natives as a form of charity. This was known to be the case for metal work, but would not be surprising if it extended to statues and other works.
“Regarding fakes (which Crespi knowingly purchases in his casual, humanitarian style, at the same time chiding the seller): “The modern solder and hacksaw marks give them away.” (p. 136)…some of the Indian diggers in Ecuador have cut up and reshaped genuinely ancient and priceless materials in order to get any kind of price at all for it.”
http://chapmanresearch.org/PDF/Crespi%20Ancient%20Artifact%20Collection%20of%20Cuenca%20%20Ecuador.pdf
In addition to Crespi’s penchant for fake art, there is yet another reason to doubt reason to doubt the authenticity of these statues. That reason is the person that he contacted to investigate the bulk of his collection.
“Padre Crespi invited von Däniken to examine his vast store of treasures”
http://thelastdaysoftolemac.com/prophecy/?p=74
The same Erich von Daniken who has been known to indulge in the occasional fraud such as:
• an “ancient” cave painting in Uzbekistan
o “Funny thing, though: this isn't an ancient cave painting. The illustration was drawn to illustrate an 1967 Sputnik magazine story on the ancient astronaut theory.”
http://www.jasoncolavito.com/faking-ancient-art-in-uzbekistan.html
• “ancient” pottery depicting UFOs
o “he produced photographs of pottery that he claimed had been found in an archaeological dig. The pottery depicts flying saucers and was said to have been dated from Biblical times. However, investigators from Nova (the fine public-television science program) found the potter who had made the allegedly ancient pots. They confronted von Däniken with evidence of his fraud. His reply was that his deception was justified because some people would only believe if they saw proof”
http://www.skepdic.com/vondanik.html
• quoting from the book of Dzyan as though it were an ancient book. In fact, it was channeled by New Age guru Blavatsky.
o “the Book of Dzyan is completely made up. It is the product of the imagination of Helena Blavatsky, the Theosophical fraud. Von Daniken merely acknowledges her as the "translator" of Dzyan. Blavatsky herself elliptically acknowledged the problem of authorship in the Secret Doctrine, where the fraudulent Dzyan stanzas appear.”
http://www.jasoncolavito.com/1/post/2012/01/von-daniken-theosophy-and-the-fraudulent-book-of-dzyan.html
and
• a falsified account of visiting an Ecuadorian cave housing the same kinds of artifacts Crespi was storing.
o “A third room contained artifacts that were similar to the objects that von Däniken had seen in the underground cavern that he had explored with Juan Moricz.”
http://thelastdaysoftolemac.com/prophecy/?p=74
o “The man whom he said showed him these tunnels, Juan Moricz, told Der Spiegel that von Däniken's descriptions came from a long conversation and that the photos in the book had been "fiddled".[20] Von Däniken told Playboy that although he had seen the library and other places he had described, he had fabricated some of the events to add interest to his book…Later in 1978 he said that he had never been in the cave pictured in his book but in a "side entrance", and that he had fabricated the whole descend to the cave…A geologist examined the area and found no cave systems.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Von_Daniken#Errors_and_omissions
Although there is little information available – to either prove or disprove – the Cuenca, Ecuador “space suit” figures of Carlos Crespi, one should at least consider the possibility that these are but one of many frauds in Crespi’s collection and one of many frauds being used to perpetuate the ancient astronaut lie. In light of the fact that the “space suit” figures have toes and one has exposed skin, their being proof of space exploration are laughable. Added to this, Crespi’s acquisition of fakes and associations with von Daniken and there is far more evidence against the authenticity of these figures than there are for it.
Georgio:
Why would ancient astronauts have to wear an astronaut suit that we’re familiar with today? The answer is very simple. Can we go through space without wearing a type of suit? Of course not, we would die. Because, who says that whoever visited us in the remote past that they could breathe in the atmosphere of planet earth? It’s not farfetched to suggest that they did in fact wear some type of suit.
Narrator: Why might these images resemble modern astronauts? If they are aliens, is it possible that they are similar to humans? Could they have come from a planet just like Earth?
Refutation
If the aliens required a suit to be on our planet, one wonders how the stories of “alien visitors” mating with human women worked out. In the Ancient Aliens show, it is claimed that the visitors are like us. If they are, again why the need for a suit?
Ancient astronaut theorists use artwork from the past as proof that aliens have visited earth in the past. Often times, they use cave paintings and petroglyphs which have many interpretations that should be considered before entertaining the thought of aliens. Aside from that “evidence” alien theorists also use statues as proof.
Turkey
One such statue, pictured below, was alleged to be a three thousand year old statue depicting a rocket man. It was claimed by Zechariah Sitchin (who has been sufficiently discredited via www.sitchiniswrong.com) that it depicted a “pilot as sitting with legs folded toward his chest, and wearing a one-piece "ribbed pressure suit" which becomes boots at the feet, and gloves at the hands, and points out that since the pilot’s head is missing, we cannot know whether the pilot wore a helmet, goggles, or other headgear.”
http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/sitchin/esp_sitchin_13.htm
http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/sitchin/esp_sitchin_13.htm
Despite its supposed age, evidence to the contrary of its ancient origins has surfaced.
“It became evident that the alleged three thousand year old Space Module that was hosted by the Archaeological Museum of Istanbul was in actuality made from plaster 25 years ago…But conclusions of the Ministry of Arts and Culture Memorial and Museums department chemical and petro-graphical analyses proved that those theories didn’t agree with historical reality…The General Director of the Museum Ph. D. Alpay Pasinli said that, the artifact could not be from three thousand years, but rather from 25 years the most.”
http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/sitchin/esp_sitchin_28.htm
A post by Elirien on the Project Avalon forum serves as the origin of the above quote. Here is Elirien’s post in its entirety.
“The three thousand year old space module was 25 year old plaster!
It became evident that The alleged three thousand year old Space Module that was hosted by the Archaeological Museum of Istanbul was in actuality made from plaster 25 years ago.
The space module which was found “matchless” by museum curators, found as a three thousand year old space module of the Urartu Kingdom many headlines to news in the western press. But conclusions of the Ministry of Arts and Culture Memorial and Museums department chemical and petro-graphical analyses proved that those theories didn’t agree with historical reality.
There is various and contradicting information concerning how the artifact came to the museum. One of the theories is that an antique merchant brought it to the museum. The space module, which has five engines is 23 centimeters long and 9,5 centimeters high. The General Director of the Museum Ph. D. Alpay Pasinli said that, the artifact could not be from three thousand years, but rather from 25 years the most. Pasinli, who said that we should remember that the western press convinced their public that the space module was three thousand years old, added that they have confirmed that this artifact was made out of plaster and marble dust through the results from analyses.
The space module, which became one of the most popular artifacts of the Istanbul Archeological Museum and was sought after by western scientists and media, was written about in tens of Articles in Europe and became news in many newspapers and television news casts. The space module which was sought after by German and English archeologists in the beginning of the 1990’s was for a long time secured in the preservation unit of the museum. The first who succeeded in photographing the space module was the English Magazine “Fortean Times”. The Magazine, which showed a picture of the sculpture and head lined “Is it an ancient space module?” in their October 1993 issue was followed by the German magazine “Magazin 2000”. After this event the competing firm of Magazin 2000, G.A.R.L. sent their editor to Istanbul and he shared his findings with the public. But almost all of the research and what was presented to the public was written in this manner: “It is confirmed that the space ship that is now in the Istanbul Archeological Museum was found in a archeological dig made in 1975 in the old city of Tuspa that is also known as Toprakkale. It is in the northeast of the Van lake where the Urartu Kingdom spread between 830-612 BC.” After these allegations were made it was written that it was in the Istanbul Archeological Museum but not on public display.
Zecharia Sitchin, linguistic and Bible scholar and writer of the book “The 12th Planet”, made the greatest research on the controversial “Space Module”. Sitchin, who came in the beginning of the 90’s to Turkey came in the forefront of the people that claimed that the Space Module was three thousand years old. Sitchin made these remarks after the sculpture left the preservation unit of the museum and was presented to him on a velvet tray: “The object, was made out of a porous material that could probably be a stone made out of volcanic ash. The bends and amazing amount of detail disproves that it was made from raw labor. Was it really a plaster caste that came out of a plastic toy as claimed by the museums official explanations? It doesn’t seem that way.
There are various and contradicting information concerning how and from where the “Space Module” was brought to the Istanbul Archeological Museum. The most popular idea is that an antique trader brought the sculpture and after realizing that it was fake he didn’t pursue it. The Space module which is 23 centimeters long, 9,5 centimeters high and 8 centimeters wide has five engines. There is also a pilot figure on the small sculpture that has bent his knees reaching its chest. The clothing of the pilot resembles the space suits that astronauts wear.
source: http://arsiv.zaman.com.tr/2003/04/30/kultur/h6.htm (in turkish though, I translated it).”
http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=5976&page=3
And here is the text from Zaman.com translated via Google translate. It seems to be the same text that Elirien posted on the forum.
“Three thousand year old space module 'alçıymış 25 years!
Istanbul Archaeological Museum, and three thousand years in the alleged 'Space Module, plaster, made 25 years ago emerged.
Curators 'unique' which he described as a spacecraft, the Western media 'Urartians spacecraft belonging to three thousand years' title was subject to numerous news. However, the Ministry of Culture commissioned by the Directorate General of Monuments and Museums, as a result of chemical and petrographic analyzes, these views are inconsistent with the historical facts understood.
There are conflicting accounts about where it came from the work to the museum. Module according to one of these views has brought to the museum an antique dealer. 23 cm long and 9.5 cm high, the space module has 5 engine. Director General of Monuments and Museums, Dr. Alpay Pasinli of the work, three thousand years ago, but that he might have made more than 25 years ago. Western scientists wrote articles and writings he promotes his own public opinion reminiscent of the space module Pasinli three thousand years, "Reviews of plaster and marble dust as a result of this work have been generated." He said.
Istanbul Archaeological Museum, which is one of the most popular, and the median Western scientists will pursue to see 'Space Module' in Europe to date related to the article published in dozens, many newspapers and television news. To see themselves in pursuit of the German and British archaeologists in the early 1990s' Space Module ', a long time the Istanbul Archaeological Museums' department of housing was kept hidden. 'Space Module Fortean Times magazine, the British had succeeded in the first viewing. October 1993 along with a photograph of the statue in the number of "Old Is A Space Module?" The title of the magazine who, in 1994 the German magazine 'Magazine 2000' was followed. 'Rival broadcaster Magazine 2000' WITH LAUREL 'after this incident, the editor sent to Istanbul. He reached as a result of the research information shared with his readers. But emerging and Western public opinion is reflected in almost every survey information as follows: "stored in the Istanbul Archaeological Museum spacecraft, now known as the former Tuşpa Toprakkale located in the city in 1975, is confirmed by the excavations of the ordinary. BC It BC 830'dan Dispersed up to 612 of the Urartu civilization in the northeast of Lake Van. "After giving the information in the form of" this extraordinary object, now the Archaeological Museum in Istanbul, but sergilenmemektedir. "Was called.
Controversial 'Space Module' makes the most extensive research and Bible scholar, linguist, '12. Planet ', the author Zecharia Sitchin'di. Sitchin came to Turkey in the early 1990s, 'Space Module, believing that the 3000 year was one of the names. Sitchin, the museum 'housing removed from the Department,' velvet tray in the 'sculpture shown to him had made determinations regarding the following: "The object, presumably consisting of a volcanic ash porous stone that may be made of a substance. Accordance with amazing curves and other details are also refutes the idea that it is a crude product of labor. Removed from the official descriptions of the museum, such as a plaster mold with a plastic toy did? It does not appear at all. "
'Space Module into the Istanbul Archaeological Museum where it came from and how it is in the contradictory opinions. According to the most common opinion, the seller brought an antique statue, and one more on the pursuit of understanding does not fall into being a fake. 23 cm long, 9.5 cm high, 8 cm wide, the 'Space Module'' of the five engines. Heykelcikte, legs curled up toward the chest as a pilot figure is also a sitting. Clothes worn by the pilot of the 'space suit worn by astronot'ların resembles.
Abdullah Kilic / Istanbul”
Unfortunately for Sitchin and the ancient astronaut crowd, the reality of the rocket man statue is that it is unable to hold up to serious scrutiny.
Japan
Another set of statues purported to be a depiction of an ancient astronaut. The Dogu statues of Japan. (http://www.e-yakimono.net/html/jomon-dogu.html) Dogu come in many styles, but the “slitted-goggles” (pictured below) variety are arguably the most famous. Many of them are unusual to be sure, but not all of them look like aliens. Additionally, besides an alien explanation, a more plausible theory has been given for at least some of the figures.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dog%C5%AB
And a few dogu that are obviously stylized people, and widely ignored by ancient aliens folks.
http://www.e-yakimono.net/html/jomon-dogu.html
A user on abovetopsecret (http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread544923/pg1) has cleverly discovered that the Dogu pictured above may actually be a stylized version of one of the Inuit people. The eyes are actually said to be Inuit snow goggles and the puffy “space suit” is actually winter attire.
http://anthromuseum.missouri.edu/archiveaids/cordle.shtml
http://www.sinc.stonybrook.edu/Clubs/socia/web_items/old_website/
It’s not completely unfeasible that the Japanese could have encountered Inuit people in the distant past. Certainly it’s more believable than aliens from light years away. There’s evidence to suggest that some Japanese or elements of their culture made it as far as New Mexico, so encountering . The language of the Zuni people in New Mexico may be a variant of Japanese suggesting some relation between the two cultures. After all, the Native Americans had to come from somewhere and it’s commonly accepted theory that they traveled from Asia across the Bering land bridge.
“The Zuni Enigma, by Nancy Yaw Davis offers a comparative of cognates between the Zuni language and another language isolate; the Japanese language. While speculative… it demonstrates a likeness between the Zuni and Japanese languages that may be more compelling than that of the Penutian Hypothesis.”
http://www.amerindianarts.us/articles/zuni_language.shtml
“For example, the Zuni word for "clan" is "kwe," while in Japanese it is "kwai." The word for "clown" is "newe" in Japanese and "niwaka" in Zuni. "Priest" is "shawani" in Japanese and "shiwani" in Zuni…And then there was the whole syntax thing -- both languages use the verb as the last word of a sentence, a feature only 45 percent of languages share.”
http://www.cracked.com/article_19769_5-baffling-discoveries-that-prove-history-books-are-wrong_p2.html
And other evidence is available here:
http://www.science-frontiers.com/sf087/sf087a02.htm
Ecuador
In Cuenca, Ecuador a number of artifacts have been found, most of which were presented to Father Carlos Crespi, Catholic priest/missionary to the Native people of that area. Many of these are metal work, gold, brass and the like. Among the many artifacts given to him by the Natives, often in exchange for money, were figures that appeared in the Ancient Aliens shows. This one was displayed quite prominently, and from the vantage point it was shown does indeed look like a space suit.
screenshot of Ancient Aliens
Apparently the History Channel's penchant for deception still applies here. Here is the same “space suit” seen from a whole body angle.
Notice that this figure has toes that are not protected by the “suit,” in addition to a large amount of what appears to be exposed skin. So if it is a suit, it isn’t going to keep the astronaut alive for very long.
http://aenigmaunveiled.wordpress.com/2011/04/20/ufo-in-prehistoric-art-i/
The below figure, also said to be evidence of an ancient space suit has the same exact problem in addition to missing his face plate.
http://aenigmaunveiled.wordpress.com/2011/04/20/ufo-in-prehistoric-art-i/
There is little to no information available about this statue, or most such figures outside of the connection to the ancient astronaut theory. The only other information that comes up for these two figures is that they are from Cuenca, Ecuador and in all likelihood part of the collection of Father Carlos Crespi. Crespi was a missionary (sometimes rumored to be Hitler in disguise) on assignment from the Vatican and he often took in artifacts found by the native people in exchange for money. He was known to purchase fake artwork from the Natives as a form of charity. This was known to be the case for metal work, but would not be surprising if it extended to statues and other works.
“Regarding fakes (which Crespi knowingly purchases in his casual, humanitarian style, at the same time chiding the seller): “The modern solder and hacksaw marks give them away.” (p. 136)…some of the Indian diggers in Ecuador have cut up and reshaped genuinely ancient and priceless materials in order to get any kind of price at all for it.”
http://chapmanresearch.org/PDF/Crespi%20Ancient%20Artifact%20Collection%20of%20Cuenca%20%20Ecuador.pdf
In addition to Crespi’s penchant for fake art, there is yet another reason to doubt reason to doubt the authenticity of these statues. That reason is the person that he contacted to investigate the bulk of his collection.
“Padre Crespi invited von Däniken to examine his vast store of treasures”
http://thelastdaysoftolemac.com/prophecy/?p=74
The same Erich von Daniken who has been known to indulge in the occasional fraud such as:
• an “ancient” cave painting in Uzbekistan
o “Funny thing, though: this isn't an ancient cave painting. The illustration was drawn to illustrate an 1967 Sputnik magazine story on the ancient astronaut theory.”
http://www.jasoncolavito.com/faking-ancient-art-in-uzbekistan.html
• “ancient” pottery depicting UFOs
o “he produced photographs of pottery that he claimed had been found in an archaeological dig. The pottery depicts flying saucers and was said to have been dated from Biblical times. However, investigators from Nova (the fine public-television science program) found the potter who had made the allegedly ancient pots. They confronted von Däniken with evidence of his fraud. His reply was that his deception was justified because some people would only believe if they saw proof”
http://www.skepdic.com/vondanik.html
• quoting from the book of Dzyan as though it were an ancient book. In fact, it was channeled by New Age guru Blavatsky.
o “the Book of Dzyan is completely made up. It is the product of the imagination of Helena Blavatsky, the Theosophical fraud. Von Daniken merely acknowledges her as the "translator" of Dzyan. Blavatsky herself elliptically acknowledged the problem of authorship in the Secret Doctrine, where the fraudulent Dzyan stanzas appear.”
http://www.jasoncolavito.com/1/post/2012/01/von-daniken-theosophy-and-the-fraudulent-book-of-dzyan.html
and
• a falsified account of visiting an Ecuadorian cave housing the same kinds of artifacts Crespi was storing.
o “A third room contained artifacts that were similar to the objects that von Däniken had seen in the underground cavern that he had explored with Juan Moricz.”
http://thelastdaysoftolemac.com/prophecy/?p=74
o “The man whom he said showed him these tunnels, Juan Moricz, told Der Spiegel that von Däniken's descriptions came from a long conversation and that the photos in the book had been "fiddled".[20] Von Däniken told Playboy that although he had seen the library and other places he had described, he had fabricated some of the events to add interest to his book…Later in 1978 he said that he had never been in the cave pictured in his book but in a "side entrance", and that he had fabricated the whole descend to the cave…A geologist examined the area and found no cave systems.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Von_Daniken#Errors_and_omissions
Although there is little information available – to either prove or disprove – the Cuenca, Ecuador “space suit” figures of Carlos Crespi, one should at least consider the possibility that these are but one of many frauds in Crespi’s collection and one of many frauds being used to perpetuate the ancient astronaut lie. In light of the fact that the “space suit” figures have toes and one has exposed skin, their being proof of space exploration are laughable. Added to this, Crespi’s acquisition of fakes and associations with von Daniken and there is far more evidence against the authenticity of these figures than there are for it.
UFO Over Jerusalem: Red Sky or Big Lie?
In September, Ancient Aliens will be debunked. Here's the trailer:
http://conspiracyclothes.com/nowheretorun/video-only-ancient-aliens-debunked-trailer/
And here's some details to one of the claims that will be looked at.
Claim
Bill Birnes Ph.D claims:
During the crusades, over Jerusalem over Turkey, at certain places in battles. There are images captured in texts about a strange cloud in the sky that glowed red.
Refutation
To start with, Dr. Birnes doesn’t give us much to go on here. He probably does have a specific case and situation in mind, but due to the editing that History Channel is notorious for we don’t get to know what he’s talking about.
The most likely scenario being suggest is one recorded by Ekkehard of Aura, the abbot of a monastery. http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/05371a.htm Ekkehard recorded many events in his life, and one of them was an event of red clouds in the sky.
From "Jerusalem Journey" Ekkehard Aura
“After the sign in the sun that had been foretold was seen, many portents appeared in the sky as well as on the earth and excited not a few who were previously indifferent to the Crusade. We thought that some of these signs could be usefully inserted here: to give all of them would be very tedious. About the fifth of October we saw a comet in the south, its tail extending sideways like a sword. In the third year after these events, on February 24, we saw another star in the east changing its position by leaps and bounds after a long interval.
We and many witnesses attest to have seen blood-red clouds rising from the west as well as the east and rushing together in the center of the sky, as well as brilliant fires from the north in the middle of the night, and frequently even sparks flying through the air.
Not many years before, a priest of venerable life by the name of Siger one day at about three in the afternoon saw two knights charging against each other in the sky and fighting for a long time. The one who was carrying a good-sized cross with which he struck the other turned out the victor.
At the same time the priest G. (now a monk with us, paying the humble service of a proud man to Christ for the sins of our first parents) was walking in the woods with two companions about noon. He saw a sword of marvelous length, arising from an unknown source, borne off into the heavens in a whirlwind. Until the distance hid it, he heard its din and saw its steel. Others who kept watch feeding horses reported that they saw the likeness of a city in the air and that they beheld various crowds hurrying to it from different places both on horseback and on foot.
Some showed the sign of the cross stamped by divine influence on their foreheads or clothes or on some part of their body, and by that mark they believed themselves to be ordained for the army of God. Others who were converted by a sudden change of heart or instructed by a vision in the night sold their manors and household possessions and sewed the sign of mortification on their clothes. In the midst of all of this, more people than can be believed ran to the churches in crowds, and the priests blessed and handed out swords, clubs, and pilgrim wallets in a new ritual.
Why should I report that at that time a woman, pregnant for two years, gave birth to a son already speaking when her womb finally opened? Why should I speak of the infant born with two members in all parts, or of another with two heads, or of the lambs with two heads, or of the foals who at birth put forth the large teeth which are commonly called "equine," and which nature grants only to three-year-olds?”
http://www.futurerevealed.com/christian/catholic/ekkehard-aura.htm
Same text as above
http://http-server.carleton.ca/~jopp/3850/3-1.htm
And here’s a new translation of the above, with commentary by Matthew King the author.
In addition to the sign in the sun that has previously been discussed148 and the many other signs that appeared in the sky and on land, exciting many previously sluggish bodies to this army, I have set forth here a most useful compilation of these omens, since truly explaining all the omens would take a very long time.149 I saw around October 7th a comet standing fixed in the southern sky, its brilliance stretching out like the broad side of a sword.150 Truly after 3 years I saw another star on February 24th, changing its location a great distance with a long leap to the East. I also confirmed red clouds, surging from the West and East, and running together mutually towards the center of the sky. Furthermore, in the middle of the night dazzling fires surged from the North,151 and I saw a little star falling across the sky, along with many other witnesses. Not long before these years a certain priest of a venerable life, by the name of Siggerius, at nearly the 3rd hour of the day, saw two horsemen charging in the sky, who were striving eagerly to fight for a long time. The one who bore the cross was not ordinary. He seemed to cut down the other and emerged victorious over the other horseman. During this same time, the priest Gaius, who now is under the monastic profession with us and has paid in full to Christ a debt of a sheep in exchange for the first born of an ass, while strolling in the forest during a certain midday hour with two companions, saw that a sword of miraculous length was being brought down from on high by an approaching whirlwind. It was lifted from there up to an unknown place, and was hidden from sight because of its altitude. Then, he discerned a crashing sound with his ears as if he saw the
(148 Ekkehard mentioned this sign in his Chronicon Universale during the year 1096. Geoergius Heinricus Pertz, eds. Monumenta Germaniae Historica: SS (Hanover: University of Neudruck Press, 1925), 208.
149 More than any other crusade writer of the early 12th century, Ekkehard is entrenched in eschatological omens. Since he is writing after the success of the First Crusade, he likely sees the capture of Jerusalem as a prerequisite for the commencement of the End of Days. These omens also confirm to Ekkehard that the crusade is indeed a divine endeavor supported by God.
150 The presence of this comet was also confirmed by the anonymous author of the Annalista Saxo, who saw it on October 7th, 1096. MGH, SS, VI, 367.
151 This could be a description of the Aurora Borealis.)
metal with his eyes. Others, who were keeping watch over a pasture of horses, reported that they saw a spectacle in the sky of a city, where they saw diverse mobs of horsemen and foot soldiers hastening in different directions. Some of them even showed the sign of the cross imprinted on their foreheads, garments, or another location on the body. Because of this brand itself, they believed that they were ordained to the same army of the Lord. Likewise, it pleased others, who were either stimulated by a sudden change of mind or instructed by a nocturnal vision, to dissolve their lands and familial property, and to sew the sign of mortification onto their clothing. And in all of these places, beyond what could be believed, when the people were running to the churches in crowds, the priestly blessing, given in accordance with the new rite, dispersed the sword with sticks and reliquaries. Why should I tell you about a certain woman at that time who was pregnant for two full years and finally when her uterus was ripped open, gave birth to a son who could speak, a little infant who was two-limbed throughout, and another one with two heads, and also some lambs who were born with two heads, and even the young of female horses, who brought forth in the midst of birth, larger teeth that they commonly call equine teeth, which nature gives only to three year old pack horses.”
https://digital.lib.washington.edu/dspace/bitstream/handle/1773/16588/Matt%20King%20Research%20Project.pdf?sequence=1
Well, what’s going on here? Ekkehard is clearly describing natural occurrences and even admits as much when describing the comet. Where it gets colorful is when he sees fire from the north. That on the surface could be sold as a UFO by the ancient aliens crowd, but King postulated that it was merely the northern lights. What of the red clouds then?
It very well could have been a meteorite.
“I saw another star on February 24th, changing its location a great distance with a long leap to the East. I also confirmed red clouds, surging from the West and East”
A long leap to the east could be suggesting that the object had come from the west, then streaked across the sky to the west. If this were the case, the red clouds in the west could be from the object burning up upon entry. The clouds in the east, from its impact with earth. This would also easily explain why the clouds appeared to be joining together as they were both from the same event. Alternately, the object could have broken up on entry with part landing in the east and a smaller part burning up completely on a westbound trajectory.
The city in the sky is indeed a little harder to explain. One key thing to consider though is that in the city that was seen, the witnesses reported that they saw horsemen. If these were aliens or a UFO, why would there be men on horses? Furthermore, there are no details insinuating that the city might be an ET craft. All descriptions of this event sound like a mdieval city, not a space craft. Many UFOs reported now are easily reported as discs, spheres, rectangles, triangles and so on, there have been no cases of a UFO looking like a city, even when they are exceptionally large.
This vision of an army and city in the sky can be seen in one of two ways. Firstly, the real astronomical phenomena were embellished and mixed with religious propaganda to recruit soldiers for the crusades. Secondly, they really did see something but it was neither God nor alien, but perhaps a lying spirit.
Regarding the vision as propaganda. What better way would there be to recruit siege fodder than with a “divine revelation”? Unfortunately, many people have been misled into disaster by following an alleged vision from God. To be sure, the use of alleged spiritual visions was not unheard of in the eleventh and twelfth centuries. It happened as far back as Biblical times, and it happens now.
In Miri Rubin’s "Gentile Tales" numerous examples of impressive and sometimes outlandish visions from the middle ages are presented. They have an obvious feeling of propaganda and were used for the purpose of enforcing Church doctrine and converting Jews. In short, anti-semitism was reinforced with “heavenly visions.” Here are a few examples.
On page 9 of Gentile Tales, there is a story from the twelfth-century range (Ekkehard was eleventh century) which tells of a Jewish boy receiving a vision of the virgin Mary while attending service and receiving the Communion Host. Another tale on the same page tells the story of a Jewish boy who went to a Catholic service and received Communion. As a result, his Jewish father threw him into a fire. Miraculously, of course, Mary saved him from being burnt and the story ends with the wicked father’s death. The story of the Jewish boy, his wicked father and Mary’s timely rescue took on many variations and spread widely.
Later on in Gentile Tales, on page 36, another strange tale is told. Some Jews allegedly wanted a Communion host wafer so badly that they held up a priest for one. The priest claimed that he no longer had one, but that it was instead in his soul and heart. They then killed him and ripped his heart out, but immediately a boy was said to have appeared from his heart. A boy that claimed to be Jesus Christ. After a brief sermon, the boy went back into the priest’s heart and raised him from the dead.
Those are just two examples of divine encounters used by the Church of its day to turn average people against Jews and into the arms of the Church. If they did this for such a small thing as excluding Jews and strengthening their hold on people, it should at least be considered that the same was done for recruiting soldiers.
The second possibility is that the city in the sky (and the other stories presented) did indeed really happen, but as mentioned before were not UFOs. Remember they saw horses and a city. Rather than aliens, any beings seen by these crusaders would likely have been demonic imposters. They have a motive to mislead and destroy humanity, and what better way than to enlist them in a religious war? This is highly possible, as we are not told that anyone tested the spirits.
1 John 4 gives Christians the key to discerning if a spiritual encounter is truly from God or not.
1Jo 4:1 KJV - Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.
1Jo 4:2 KJV - Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:
1Jo 4:3 KJV - And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that [spirit] of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=1Jo&c=4&v=1&t=KJV#1
Furthermore, 1 Timothy 4:1 warns us that seducing spirits would lead people astray and 2 Thessalonians 2:9-12 reinforces that. While 2 Thessalonians definitely speaks of the end days, it could be applied to many other situations as well.
1Ti 4:1 KJV - Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
1Ti 4:2 KJV - Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;
http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=1Ti&c=4&v=1&t=KJV#1
2Th 2:9 KJV - [Even him], whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
2Th 2:10 KJV - And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
2Th 2:11 KJV - And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
2Th 2:12 KJV - That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=2Th&c=2&v=1&t=KJV
The red clouds in the sky can be easily attributed to a crashing meteorite, comets and the Northern Lights, some of which Ekkehard clearly identified. These were given a greater spiritual significance and possible embellishment, potentially for recruiting purposes.
The city in the sky was clearly described as a city and was filled with horsemen. This is nowhere near close to any modern UFO sighting. Even extremely large UFOs (sometimes up to 1 mile in size) are never described as a city but as a large object, usually a disc. This city in the sky was either 1) made up, again to recruit troops for the crusades or 2) was a spiritual vision provided by demonic spirits.
In either situation, there are more plausible explanations that do not necessitate alien visitors, and involve a more likely candidate, human deception for personal gain.
http://conspiracyclothes.com/nowheretorun/video-only-ancient-aliens-debunked-trailer/
And here's some details to one of the claims that will be looked at.
Claim
Bill Birnes Ph.D claims:
During the crusades, over Jerusalem over Turkey, at certain places in battles. There are images captured in texts about a strange cloud in the sky that glowed red.
Refutation
To start with, Dr. Birnes doesn’t give us much to go on here. He probably does have a specific case and situation in mind, but due to the editing that History Channel is notorious for we don’t get to know what he’s talking about.
The most likely scenario being suggest is one recorded by Ekkehard of Aura, the abbot of a monastery. http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/05371a.htm Ekkehard recorded many events in his life, and one of them was an event of red clouds in the sky.
From "Jerusalem Journey" Ekkehard Aura
“After the sign in the sun that had been foretold was seen, many portents appeared in the sky as well as on the earth and excited not a few who were previously indifferent to the Crusade. We thought that some of these signs could be usefully inserted here: to give all of them would be very tedious. About the fifth of October we saw a comet in the south, its tail extending sideways like a sword. In the third year after these events, on February 24, we saw another star in the east changing its position by leaps and bounds after a long interval.
We and many witnesses attest to have seen blood-red clouds rising from the west as well as the east and rushing together in the center of the sky, as well as brilliant fires from the north in the middle of the night, and frequently even sparks flying through the air.
Not many years before, a priest of venerable life by the name of Siger one day at about three in the afternoon saw two knights charging against each other in the sky and fighting for a long time. The one who was carrying a good-sized cross with which he struck the other turned out the victor.
At the same time the priest G. (now a monk with us, paying the humble service of a proud man to Christ for the sins of our first parents) was walking in the woods with two companions about noon. He saw a sword of marvelous length, arising from an unknown source, borne off into the heavens in a whirlwind. Until the distance hid it, he heard its din and saw its steel. Others who kept watch feeding horses reported that they saw the likeness of a city in the air and that they beheld various crowds hurrying to it from different places both on horseback and on foot.
Some showed the sign of the cross stamped by divine influence on their foreheads or clothes or on some part of their body, and by that mark they believed themselves to be ordained for the army of God. Others who were converted by a sudden change of heart or instructed by a vision in the night sold their manors and household possessions and sewed the sign of mortification on their clothes. In the midst of all of this, more people than can be believed ran to the churches in crowds, and the priests blessed and handed out swords, clubs, and pilgrim wallets in a new ritual.
Why should I report that at that time a woman, pregnant for two years, gave birth to a son already speaking when her womb finally opened? Why should I speak of the infant born with two members in all parts, or of another with two heads, or of the lambs with two heads, or of the foals who at birth put forth the large teeth which are commonly called "equine," and which nature grants only to three-year-olds?”
http://www.futurerevealed.com/christian/catholic/ekkehard-aura.htm
Same text as above
http://http-server.carleton.ca/~jopp/3850/3-1.htm
And here’s a new translation of the above, with commentary by Matthew King the author.
In addition to the sign in the sun that has previously been discussed148 and the many other signs that appeared in the sky and on land, exciting many previously sluggish bodies to this army, I have set forth here a most useful compilation of these omens, since truly explaining all the omens would take a very long time.149 I saw around October 7th a comet standing fixed in the southern sky, its brilliance stretching out like the broad side of a sword.150 Truly after 3 years I saw another star on February 24th, changing its location a great distance with a long leap to the East. I also confirmed red clouds, surging from the West and East, and running together mutually towards the center of the sky. Furthermore, in the middle of the night dazzling fires surged from the North,151 and I saw a little star falling across the sky, along with many other witnesses. Not long before these years a certain priest of a venerable life, by the name of Siggerius, at nearly the 3rd hour of the day, saw two horsemen charging in the sky, who were striving eagerly to fight for a long time. The one who bore the cross was not ordinary. He seemed to cut down the other and emerged victorious over the other horseman. During this same time, the priest Gaius, who now is under the monastic profession with us and has paid in full to Christ a debt of a sheep in exchange for the first born of an ass, while strolling in the forest during a certain midday hour with two companions, saw that a sword of miraculous length was being brought down from on high by an approaching whirlwind. It was lifted from there up to an unknown place, and was hidden from sight because of its altitude. Then, he discerned a crashing sound with his ears as if he saw the
(148 Ekkehard mentioned this sign in his Chronicon Universale during the year 1096. Geoergius Heinricus Pertz, eds. Monumenta Germaniae Historica: SS (Hanover: University of Neudruck Press, 1925), 208.
149 More than any other crusade writer of the early 12th century, Ekkehard is entrenched in eschatological omens. Since he is writing after the success of the First Crusade, he likely sees the capture of Jerusalem as a prerequisite for the commencement of the End of Days. These omens also confirm to Ekkehard that the crusade is indeed a divine endeavor supported by God.
150 The presence of this comet was also confirmed by the anonymous author of the Annalista Saxo, who saw it on October 7th, 1096. MGH, SS, VI, 367.
151 This could be a description of the Aurora Borealis.)
metal with his eyes. Others, who were keeping watch over a pasture of horses, reported that they saw a spectacle in the sky of a city, where they saw diverse mobs of horsemen and foot soldiers hastening in different directions. Some of them even showed the sign of the cross imprinted on their foreheads, garments, or another location on the body. Because of this brand itself, they believed that they were ordained to the same army of the Lord. Likewise, it pleased others, who were either stimulated by a sudden change of mind or instructed by a nocturnal vision, to dissolve their lands and familial property, and to sew the sign of mortification onto their clothing. And in all of these places, beyond what could be believed, when the people were running to the churches in crowds, the priestly blessing, given in accordance with the new rite, dispersed the sword with sticks and reliquaries. Why should I tell you about a certain woman at that time who was pregnant for two full years and finally when her uterus was ripped open, gave birth to a son who could speak, a little infant who was two-limbed throughout, and another one with two heads, and also some lambs who were born with two heads, and even the young of female horses, who brought forth in the midst of birth, larger teeth that they commonly call equine teeth, which nature gives only to three year old pack horses.”
https://digital.lib.washington.edu/dspace/bitstream/handle/1773/16588/Matt%20King%20Research%20Project.pdf?sequence=1
Well, what’s going on here? Ekkehard is clearly describing natural occurrences and even admits as much when describing the comet. Where it gets colorful is when he sees fire from the north. That on the surface could be sold as a UFO by the ancient aliens crowd, but King postulated that it was merely the northern lights. What of the red clouds then?
It very well could have been a meteorite.
“I saw another star on February 24th, changing its location a great distance with a long leap to the East. I also confirmed red clouds, surging from the West and East”
A long leap to the east could be suggesting that the object had come from the west, then streaked across the sky to the west. If this were the case, the red clouds in the west could be from the object burning up upon entry. The clouds in the east, from its impact with earth. This would also easily explain why the clouds appeared to be joining together as they were both from the same event. Alternately, the object could have broken up on entry with part landing in the east and a smaller part burning up completely on a westbound trajectory.
The city in the sky is indeed a little harder to explain. One key thing to consider though is that in the city that was seen, the witnesses reported that they saw horsemen. If these were aliens or a UFO, why would there be men on horses? Furthermore, there are no details insinuating that the city might be an ET craft. All descriptions of this event sound like a mdieval city, not a space craft. Many UFOs reported now are easily reported as discs, spheres, rectangles, triangles and so on, there have been no cases of a UFO looking like a city, even when they are exceptionally large.
This vision of an army and city in the sky can be seen in one of two ways. Firstly, the real astronomical phenomena were embellished and mixed with religious propaganda to recruit soldiers for the crusades. Secondly, they really did see something but it was neither God nor alien, but perhaps a lying spirit.
Regarding the vision as propaganda. What better way would there be to recruit siege fodder than with a “divine revelation”? Unfortunately, many people have been misled into disaster by following an alleged vision from God. To be sure, the use of alleged spiritual visions was not unheard of in the eleventh and twelfth centuries. It happened as far back as Biblical times, and it happens now.
In Miri Rubin’s "Gentile Tales" numerous examples of impressive and sometimes outlandish visions from the middle ages are presented. They have an obvious feeling of propaganda and were used for the purpose of enforcing Church doctrine and converting Jews. In short, anti-semitism was reinforced with “heavenly visions.” Here are a few examples.
On page 9 of Gentile Tales, there is a story from the twelfth-century range (Ekkehard was eleventh century) which tells of a Jewish boy receiving a vision of the virgin Mary while attending service and receiving the Communion Host. Another tale on the same page tells the story of a Jewish boy who went to a Catholic service and received Communion. As a result, his Jewish father threw him into a fire. Miraculously, of course, Mary saved him from being burnt and the story ends with the wicked father’s death. The story of the Jewish boy, his wicked father and Mary’s timely rescue took on many variations and spread widely.
Later on in Gentile Tales, on page 36, another strange tale is told. Some Jews allegedly wanted a Communion host wafer so badly that they held up a priest for one. The priest claimed that he no longer had one, but that it was instead in his soul and heart. They then killed him and ripped his heart out, but immediately a boy was said to have appeared from his heart. A boy that claimed to be Jesus Christ. After a brief sermon, the boy went back into the priest’s heart and raised him from the dead.
Those are just two examples of divine encounters used by the Church of its day to turn average people against Jews and into the arms of the Church. If they did this for such a small thing as excluding Jews and strengthening their hold on people, it should at least be considered that the same was done for recruiting soldiers.
The second possibility is that the city in the sky (and the other stories presented) did indeed really happen, but as mentioned before were not UFOs. Remember they saw horses and a city. Rather than aliens, any beings seen by these crusaders would likely have been demonic imposters. They have a motive to mislead and destroy humanity, and what better way than to enlist them in a religious war? This is highly possible, as we are not told that anyone tested the spirits.
1 John 4 gives Christians the key to discerning if a spiritual encounter is truly from God or not.
1Jo 4:1 KJV - Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.
1Jo 4:2 KJV - Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:
1Jo 4:3 KJV - And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that [spirit] of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=1Jo&c=4&v=1&t=KJV#1
Furthermore, 1 Timothy 4:1 warns us that seducing spirits would lead people astray and 2 Thessalonians 2:9-12 reinforces that. While 2 Thessalonians definitely speaks of the end days, it could be applied to many other situations as well.
1Ti 4:1 KJV - Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
1Ti 4:2 KJV - Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;
http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=1Ti&c=4&v=1&t=KJV#1
2Th 2:9 KJV - [Even him], whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
2Th 2:10 KJV - And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
2Th 2:11 KJV - And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
2Th 2:12 KJV - That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=2Th&c=2&v=1&t=KJV
The red clouds in the sky can be easily attributed to a crashing meteorite, comets and the Northern Lights, some of which Ekkehard clearly identified. These were given a greater spiritual significance and possible embellishment, potentially for recruiting purposes.
The city in the sky was clearly described as a city and was filled with horsemen. This is nowhere near close to any modern UFO sighting. Even extremely large UFOs (sometimes up to 1 mile in size) are never described as a city but as a large object, usually a disc. This city in the sky was either 1) made up, again to recruit troops for the crusades or 2) was a spiritual vision provided by demonic spirits.
In either situation, there are more plausible explanations that do not necessitate alien visitors, and involve a more likely candidate, human deception for personal gain.
Thursday, May 24, 2012
Sky Anchors Away: The Legend(s) of Sky Sailors and Anchors Stuck in Churches
The legends of sky ships getting their anchors stuck on churches, and an unfortunate sailor dying in our thick air trying to get it loose. This will be addressed in the "Ancient Aliens Debunked" due out in September
(http://conspiracyclothes.com/nowheretorun/video-only-ancient-aliens-debunked-trailer/) and was actually addressed in the most recent issue of (not so) "Open Minds" magazine. While "OM" addresses the sky sailor story and Magonia/Agobard accounts, they do not do so this exhaustively. In addition to the "sky ship is proof of UFOs stories," the sources they quote hold other tales that they forgot to mention. When considering this as proof for UFOs, one must consider what other information Gervase of Tillbury was providing with his "UFO" story.
Claim:
In his 13th Century historical work titled Otto Imperialia (sp), Gervase Tilbury wrote about an aerial craft over the city of Bristol, England which caught an anchor in a church steeple.
Bill Birnes, Ph.D. He uses specifically the term anchor. Now we don’t know what kind of anchor that is, but a creature, a man climbs out of this craft and tries to free the anchor from the steeple and all the people in the village start stoning him thinking he’s some sort of evil demon.
Refutation:
First, who was Gervase of Tilbury, and what exactly was Otia Imperialia about? Certainly it’s more than a work that can be used by ancient astronaut theorists. As for Gervase, he was sort of a traveling scholar. In short:
Born at Tilbury in Essex, he was a lawyer and cleric who lived most of his life abroad in the service of various rulers and prelates, notably the Emperor Otto IV, for whom he wrote, probably about 1211, a compendium of history, geography, and natural history which he called Otia Imperialia (‘Imperial Relaxations’). One section is devoted to ‘The Marvels of Each Province’ of England, ‘marvels’ (mirabilia) being defined as natural phenomena that cannot be explained, as opposed to miracles due to God's intervention. They include items which would now be classed as legend or superstition.
[emphasis added]
http://www.answers.com/topic/gervase-of-tilbury
Basically, he compiled a lot of dispersed information into one place. Most of it was your average demographic information with a final section devoted to (then) unexplainable events and/or folk tales. The alleged anchor incident was contained not within the “normal parts,” but rather in the folk tale section.
Here is a recounting of Tilbury’s 13th Century Bristol, England event that’s as good as any. The relevant part begins on Page 12, but beginning on Page 10 towards the end may give additional context.
Kelly, Walter K. Curiosities of Indo-European Tradition and Folk-lore. Pg 11-13. Web Based: Published by Adamant Media Corporation, 2006. 25 Sep 2008. (http://books.google.com/books?id=STneDBrPL0QC&printsec=copyright&dq=agobard+of+Lyon+AND+Magonia&lr=#PPP3,M1)
The main point to take away from this is that some people, and Gervase of Tilbury, believed there was an additional ocean in the sky and that there were some sort of people that lived up there. They didn’t believe that these people were from space and in at least one case an ordinary sailor was involved “proving” the sky sea theory.
“He [Gervase] believed that two remarkable events had occurred within his lifetime which proved that ‘the sea is higher than the land’, indeed that it is ‘above our habitation… either in or on the air’ (a medieval theory based on the reference in Genesis 1 to ‘waters above the firmament’).”
http://www.answers.com/topic/gervase-of-tilbury
For contrast, here’s another version of Gervase’s tale, presumably right from Otia Imperiale. Notice that the anchor was caught in a wall, not the steeple and that the sailor “drowned” and was not stoned. Emphasis added.
A strange event in our own times, which is widely known but none the less a cause of wonder, provides proof of the existence of an upper sea overhead. It occurred on a feast day in Britain, while the people were struggling out of their parish church after hearing high mass. The day was very overcast and quite dark on account of the thick clouds. To the people’s amazement, a ship’s anchor was seen caught on a tombstone within the churchyard walls, with its rope stretching up and hanging in the air. They were advancing various opinions on the matter to each other, when after a time they saw the rope move as if it were being worked to pull up the anchor. Since, being caught fast, it would not give way, a sound was heard in the humid air as of sailors struggling to recover the anchor they had cast down.”
Soon, when their efforts proved vain, the sailors sent one of their number down; using the same technique as our sailors here below, he gripped the anchor-rope and climbed down it, swinging one hand over the other. He had already pulled the anchor free, when he was seized by the bystanders. He then expired in the hands of his captors, suffocated by the humidity of our dense air as if he were drowning at sea. The sailors up above wasted an hour, but then, concluding that their companion had drowned, they cut the rope and sailed away, leaving the anchor behind. And so in memory of this event it was fittingly decided that that anchor should be used to make ironwork for the church door, and it is still there for all to see.”
http://mysteriousuniverse.org/2011/09/anchors-aweigh-sky-ships-and-storm-wizards/
Interestingly, Gervase is rumored to have run across more or less the same story happening in a different place and slightly later on. It’s so similar that the church of the event used the anchor as decorative metalwork. But this time it wasn’t Bristol, but rather Kent. What rotten luck air sailors must have.
Another account which is also often attributed to Gervase allegedly occurred in 1211 (or possibly 1214 — these dates are exceedingly difficult to pin down) in Gravesend, which is located in northwest Kent, England. Again the event involved a group of churchgoers who were attending services. This time the folks claimed to have seen the curious anchor plummet from the heavens and, much like in the Tilbury case, snag itself onto a tombstone in the graveyard which was adjacent to the church.
In another moment that smacks of déjà vu, the parishioners rushed outside to see an inexplicably floating sky ship and what can only be qualified as humanoid sailor leaping over the side. As in the previous account, there is no report of this aeronaut being tethered to the ship — or wearing any sort of protective gear for that matter — as it slowly made its way toward terra firma.
The God fearing mob — no doubt incited by fear or perhaps overcome by the exhilaration of contacting what may well have been construed as a divine life form — attempted to subdue the aeronaut, but he must have heard of the fates of this less fortunate brethren and was too swift and managed to scurry back up the “rope” unharmed. The lucky sky swimmer’s comrades saw what transpired from high above and sagely cut the tether that attached their craft to the trapped anchor and the vehicle “sailed out of sight.”
According to legend a local blacksmith made ornaments from the abandoned anchor that were used to adorn the lectern in the house of worship. An alternate version of the tale suggests a more grim fate for our poor aeronaut and, like his Tilbury counterpart, the being was said to have “drown” in the arms of his assailants, at which point its fellow crew members cut him and the anchor loose. In this version of events the anchor was melted and forged into new hinges for the church doors
http://mysteriousuniverse.org/2011/09/anchors-aweigh-sky-ships-and-storm-wizards/
Ancient Aliens claimed that the pilot was stoned, but clearly that wasn’t the case if they are referring to the account of Gervase. In the several versions attributed to Gervase, he recorded that the pilot drowned in our heavy atmosphere. Sure, there is mention that the people grabbed him, but no evidence of stoning appears. One wonders if he was an ancient astronaut, why wasn’t he wearing his suit to prevent “drowning?” Especially since so many ancient aliens theorists find evidence for suits everywhere.
Back to the version of the “sky sailor” where he was stoned by the townspeople. That version of the story comes from a UFO book in the 60’s. This book also claims that the anchor was caught in a steeple, and not a stone in the wall. Bill Birnes of Ancient Aliens is quoting the story from the UFO book, not the Otia Imperialia.
1270 A. D. Bristol England: "In Otto Imperialia, Book I, Chapter XIII, Gervase of Tillbury wrote about an aerial craft over a city. The craft caught an anchor in a church steeple and a occupant of the ship scampered down a ladder to free the device. The man was stoned by a crowd and asphyxiated in the earth's atmosphere. The 'demon's body' was said to have been burned." This story is to be found in several UFO books, and is quoted here from Let's Face the Facts about Flying Saucers, (1967) by Warren Smith and Gabriel Green, President of the Amalgamated Flying Saucer Clubs of America.
http://files.ncas.org/condon/text/s5chap01.htm
So far there’s several versions of the Bristol incident, plus the incident in Kent a few years later. Given that there are two identical incidents involving an air sailor some discretion should be applied to accepting how true it is. How about if there was a third one?
In 965 AD, supposedly recorded in an Irish record called “Speculum Regali” is the following story. Emphasis added for the similar elements.
“There happened in the borough of Cloera, one Sunday, while the people were at Mass, a marvel. In this town is a church dedicated to St. Kinarus. It befell that an anchor was dropped from the sky, with a rope attached to it, and one of the flukes caught in the arch above the church door. The people rushed out of the church and saw in the sky a ship with men on board, floating before the anchor cable, and they saw a man leap overboard and jump down to the anchor, as if to release it. He looked as if he were swimming in water. The folk rushed up and tried to seize him; but the Bishop forbade the people to hold the man, for it might kill him, he said. The man was freed, and hurried up to the ship, where the crew cut the rope and the ship sailed out of sight. But the anchor is in the church, and has been there ever since, as a testimony.”
http://mysteriousuniverse.org/2011/09/anchors-aweigh-sky-ships-and-storm-wizards/
The same story also appears here.
http://www.mysteriousbritain.co.uk/england/kent/ufos/cloera-irelandgravesend-kentbristol-ufo-1211ad.html
In addition to three nearly identical accounts involving a stuck airship and a church, there’s yet another, account of airship occupants and the threat of stoning. Prior to the Ireland account, in 9th century France, Agobard the Bishop of Lyon was informed of a group of four people, allegedly fallen from the sky, who were to be stoned by some villagers. Although the villagers claimed their captives were from the sky, Agobard dismissed this as nonsense. As a church official, his dismissal of people from the sky calls into question how some might use Genesis 1 as proof of a sea in the sky.
“But we have seen and heard of many people overcome with so much foolishness, made crazy by so much stupidity, that they believe and say that there is a certain region, which is called Magonia, from which ships come in the clouds. In these ships the crops that fell because of hail and were lost in storms are carried back into that region; evidently these aerial sailors make a payment to the storm-makers, and take the grain and other crops. Among those so blinded with profound stupidity that they believe these things could happen we have seen many people in a kind of meeting, exhibiting four captives, three men and one woman, as if they had fallen from these very ships. As I have said, they exhibited these four, who had been chained up for some days, with such a meeting finally assembling in our presence, as if these captives ought to be stoned. But when truth had prevailed, however, after much argument, the people who had exhibited the captives, in accordance with the prophecy (Jeremiah 2:26) ‘were confounded … as the thief is confounded when he is taken.’ ”
http://www.davidhalperin.net/tag/agobard-of-lyon/
Of course the story is incomplete without its alternate ending involving, you guessed it, the alleged aeronauts getting stoned by townsfolk. The author of the Mysterious Universe article compiling the airship stories also finally admits how difficult finding the truth is.
“While most assume that Agobard is claiming to have he stepped in and used his influence to prevent their deaths, some accounts maintain that they were executed all the same , which just goes to show how difficult it is to wrestle the truth from these antiquated accounts.”
http://mysteriousuniverse.org/2011/09/anchors-aweigh-sky-ships-and-storm-wizards/
David Halperin, a UFO investigator, ties this event with Agobard to another much later event from the 1700’s involving a Turkish, Jewish cult leader. He claims that it was nearly identical to the Agobard event and concludes that they had little to do with space men and more to do with psychological Jungian archetypes (which aren’t without their own faults) and/or spiritual encounters.
http://www.davidhalperin.net/the-mystery-men-of-magonia/
http://www.davidhalperin.net/more-on-the-magonia-men-and-woman/
http://www.davidhalperin.net/the-magonian-quaternity/
Moving back to Gervase of Tilbury’s account. As stated before Gervase seems to have used his “sky sailor” story as proof of a sea in the sky, and of course Ancient Aliens figures this was old time spacemen and that the sea was space.
Certainly, if the ancient astronaut theorists people want to use that story as proof, given its faults as a non-isolated incident, they can. If they do so, then they must also take into account with equal authority the second account mentioned by Gervase as he gives it equal validity to the Bristol event. On Page 13 of Curiosities of Indo-European Tradition and Folk-lore a sailor from Bristol, England dropped his knife overboard into the sea. Lo and behold, his knife then miraculously fell through a skylight in his home and onto his dinner table much to the shock of his wife.
(http://books.google.com/books?id=STneDBrPL0QC&printsec=copyright&dq=agobard+of+Lyon+AND+Magonia&lr=#PPP3,M1)
Perhaps the ancient astronaut theorists would also like to include the following accounts as well. After all, they are also in the Otia Imperialia.
Gervase is thus an important source for medieval English folklore. He gives a Gloucestershire variant of the tale of the stolen fairy goblet (cf. Willy Howe); he describes little working goblins in patched clothes, who are generally helpful but also lead travellers astray—clearly akin to Puck and pixies; he tells of a swineherd who entered the Peak cavern and reached a pleasant Otherworld where harvesting was in progress, though in the human world it was winter. He has heard of Arthur's Knights as a ghostly Wild Hunt, and of a demonic hound with fiery jaws appearing during a thunderstorm in a forest near Penrith.
http://www.answers.com/topic/gervase-of-tilbury
Given that Gervase believed that his accounts proved that there was a literal sea higher up than the ground, using it as proof of ancient astronauts hardly makes it a trustworthy piece of evidence. Especially in light of the fact that nearly the exact same story supposedly happened in so many places throughout different times. There are no less than three events involving the identical story and an additional story or two that are similar enough to raise an eyebrow. The three that are near identical even end in much the same way, even up to the inclusion of the left-behind anchor being used as metalwork for the church. And why would a UFO/alien craft use a contemporary anchor in the first place?
Either these sea-sky pilots have bad luck losing their anchors and sailors at churches and forget their protective suit, or a popular tall-tale it eventually made its rounds through the continent.
(http://conspiracyclothes.com/nowheretorun/video-only-ancient-aliens-debunked-trailer/) and was actually addressed in the most recent issue of (not so) "Open Minds" magazine. While "OM" addresses the sky sailor story and Magonia/Agobard accounts, they do not do so this exhaustively. In addition to the "sky ship is proof of UFOs stories," the sources they quote hold other tales that they forgot to mention. When considering this as proof for UFOs, one must consider what other information Gervase of Tillbury was providing with his "UFO" story.
Claim:
In his 13th Century historical work titled Otto Imperialia (sp), Gervase Tilbury wrote about an aerial craft over the city of Bristol, England which caught an anchor in a church steeple.
Bill Birnes, Ph.D. He uses specifically the term anchor. Now we don’t know what kind of anchor that is, but a creature, a man climbs out of this craft and tries to free the anchor from the steeple and all the people in the village start stoning him thinking he’s some sort of evil demon.
Refutation:
First, who was Gervase of Tilbury, and what exactly was Otia Imperialia about? Certainly it’s more than a work that can be used by ancient astronaut theorists. As for Gervase, he was sort of a traveling scholar. In short:
Born at Tilbury in Essex, he was a lawyer and cleric who lived most of his life abroad in the service of various rulers and prelates, notably the Emperor Otto IV, for whom he wrote, probably about 1211, a compendium of history, geography, and natural history which he called Otia Imperialia (‘Imperial Relaxations’). One section is devoted to ‘The Marvels of Each Province’ of England, ‘marvels’ (mirabilia) being defined as natural phenomena that cannot be explained, as opposed to miracles due to God's intervention. They include items which would now be classed as legend or superstition.
[emphasis added]
http://www.answers.com/topic/gervase-of-tilbury
Basically, he compiled a lot of dispersed information into one place. Most of it was your average demographic information with a final section devoted to (then) unexplainable events and/or folk tales. The alleged anchor incident was contained not within the “normal parts,” but rather in the folk tale section.
Here is a recounting of Tilbury’s 13th Century Bristol, England event that’s as good as any. The relevant part begins on Page 12, but beginning on Page 10 towards the end may give additional context.
Kelly, Walter K. Curiosities of Indo-European Tradition and Folk-lore. Pg 11-13. Web Based: Published by Adamant Media Corporation, 2006. 25 Sep 2008. (http://books.google.com/books?id=STneDBrPL0QC&printsec=copyright&dq=agobard+of+Lyon+AND+Magonia&lr=#PPP3,M1)
The main point to take away from this is that some people, and Gervase of Tilbury, believed there was an additional ocean in the sky and that there were some sort of people that lived up there. They didn’t believe that these people were from space and in at least one case an ordinary sailor was involved “proving” the sky sea theory.
“He [Gervase] believed that two remarkable events had occurred within his lifetime which proved that ‘the sea is higher than the land’, indeed that it is ‘above our habitation… either in or on the air’ (a medieval theory based on the reference in Genesis 1 to ‘waters above the firmament’).”
http://www.answers.com/topic/gervase-of-tilbury
For contrast, here’s another version of Gervase’s tale, presumably right from Otia Imperiale. Notice that the anchor was caught in a wall, not the steeple and that the sailor “drowned” and was not stoned. Emphasis added.
A strange event in our own times, which is widely known but none the less a cause of wonder, provides proof of the existence of an upper sea overhead. It occurred on a feast day in Britain, while the people were struggling out of their parish church after hearing high mass. The day was very overcast and quite dark on account of the thick clouds. To the people’s amazement, a ship’s anchor was seen caught on a tombstone within the churchyard walls, with its rope stretching up and hanging in the air. They were advancing various opinions on the matter to each other, when after a time they saw the rope move as if it were being worked to pull up the anchor. Since, being caught fast, it would not give way, a sound was heard in the humid air as of sailors struggling to recover the anchor they had cast down.”
Soon, when their efforts proved vain, the sailors sent one of their number down; using the same technique as our sailors here below, he gripped the anchor-rope and climbed down it, swinging one hand over the other. He had already pulled the anchor free, when he was seized by the bystanders. He then expired in the hands of his captors, suffocated by the humidity of our dense air as if he were drowning at sea. The sailors up above wasted an hour, but then, concluding that their companion had drowned, they cut the rope and sailed away, leaving the anchor behind. And so in memory of this event it was fittingly decided that that anchor should be used to make ironwork for the church door, and it is still there for all to see.”
http://mysteriousuniverse.org/2011/09/anchors-aweigh-sky-ships-and-storm-wizards/
Interestingly, Gervase is rumored to have run across more or less the same story happening in a different place and slightly later on. It’s so similar that the church of the event used the anchor as decorative metalwork. But this time it wasn’t Bristol, but rather Kent. What rotten luck air sailors must have.
Another account which is also often attributed to Gervase allegedly occurred in 1211 (or possibly 1214 — these dates are exceedingly difficult to pin down) in Gravesend, which is located in northwest Kent, England. Again the event involved a group of churchgoers who were attending services. This time the folks claimed to have seen the curious anchor plummet from the heavens and, much like in the Tilbury case, snag itself onto a tombstone in the graveyard which was adjacent to the church.
In another moment that smacks of déjà vu, the parishioners rushed outside to see an inexplicably floating sky ship and what can only be qualified as humanoid sailor leaping over the side. As in the previous account, there is no report of this aeronaut being tethered to the ship — or wearing any sort of protective gear for that matter — as it slowly made its way toward terra firma.
The God fearing mob — no doubt incited by fear or perhaps overcome by the exhilaration of contacting what may well have been construed as a divine life form — attempted to subdue the aeronaut, but he must have heard of the fates of this less fortunate brethren and was too swift and managed to scurry back up the “rope” unharmed. The lucky sky swimmer’s comrades saw what transpired from high above and sagely cut the tether that attached their craft to the trapped anchor and the vehicle “sailed out of sight.”
According to legend a local blacksmith made ornaments from the abandoned anchor that were used to adorn the lectern in the house of worship. An alternate version of the tale suggests a more grim fate for our poor aeronaut and, like his Tilbury counterpart, the being was said to have “drown” in the arms of his assailants, at which point its fellow crew members cut him and the anchor loose. In this version of events the anchor was melted and forged into new hinges for the church doors
http://mysteriousuniverse.org/2011/09/anchors-aweigh-sky-ships-and-storm-wizards/
Ancient Aliens claimed that the pilot was stoned, but clearly that wasn’t the case if they are referring to the account of Gervase. In the several versions attributed to Gervase, he recorded that the pilot drowned in our heavy atmosphere. Sure, there is mention that the people grabbed him, but no evidence of stoning appears. One wonders if he was an ancient astronaut, why wasn’t he wearing his suit to prevent “drowning?” Especially since so many ancient aliens theorists find evidence for suits everywhere.
Back to the version of the “sky sailor” where he was stoned by the townspeople. That version of the story comes from a UFO book in the 60’s. This book also claims that the anchor was caught in a steeple, and not a stone in the wall. Bill Birnes of Ancient Aliens is quoting the story from the UFO book, not the Otia Imperialia.
1270 A. D. Bristol England: "In Otto Imperialia, Book I, Chapter XIII, Gervase of Tillbury wrote about an aerial craft over a city. The craft caught an anchor in a church steeple and a occupant of the ship scampered down a ladder to free the device. The man was stoned by a crowd and asphyxiated in the earth's atmosphere. The 'demon's body' was said to have been burned." This story is to be found in several UFO books, and is quoted here from Let's Face the Facts about Flying Saucers, (1967) by Warren Smith and Gabriel Green, President of the Amalgamated Flying Saucer Clubs of America.
http://files.ncas.org/condon/text/s5chap01.htm
So far there’s several versions of the Bristol incident, plus the incident in Kent a few years later. Given that there are two identical incidents involving an air sailor some discretion should be applied to accepting how true it is. How about if there was a third one?
In 965 AD, supposedly recorded in an Irish record called “Speculum Regali” is the following story. Emphasis added for the similar elements.
“There happened in the borough of Cloera, one Sunday, while the people were at Mass, a marvel. In this town is a church dedicated to St. Kinarus. It befell that an anchor was dropped from the sky, with a rope attached to it, and one of the flukes caught in the arch above the church door. The people rushed out of the church and saw in the sky a ship with men on board, floating before the anchor cable, and they saw a man leap overboard and jump down to the anchor, as if to release it. He looked as if he were swimming in water. The folk rushed up and tried to seize him; but the Bishop forbade the people to hold the man, for it might kill him, he said. The man was freed, and hurried up to the ship, where the crew cut the rope and the ship sailed out of sight. But the anchor is in the church, and has been there ever since, as a testimony.”
http://mysteriousuniverse.org/2011/09/anchors-aweigh-sky-ships-and-storm-wizards/
The same story also appears here.
http://www.mysteriousbritain.co.uk/england/kent/ufos/cloera-irelandgravesend-kentbristol-ufo-1211ad.html
In addition to three nearly identical accounts involving a stuck airship and a church, there’s yet another, account of airship occupants and the threat of stoning. Prior to the Ireland account, in 9th century France, Agobard the Bishop of Lyon was informed of a group of four people, allegedly fallen from the sky, who were to be stoned by some villagers. Although the villagers claimed their captives were from the sky, Agobard dismissed this as nonsense. As a church official, his dismissal of people from the sky calls into question how some might use Genesis 1 as proof of a sea in the sky.
“But we have seen and heard of many people overcome with so much foolishness, made crazy by so much stupidity, that they believe and say that there is a certain region, which is called Magonia, from which ships come in the clouds. In these ships the crops that fell because of hail and were lost in storms are carried back into that region; evidently these aerial sailors make a payment to the storm-makers, and take the grain and other crops. Among those so blinded with profound stupidity that they believe these things could happen we have seen many people in a kind of meeting, exhibiting four captives, three men and one woman, as if they had fallen from these very ships. As I have said, they exhibited these four, who had been chained up for some days, with such a meeting finally assembling in our presence, as if these captives ought to be stoned. But when truth had prevailed, however, after much argument, the people who had exhibited the captives, in accordance with the prophecy (Jeremiah 2:26) ‘were confounded … as the thief is confounded when he is taken.’ ”
http://www.davidhalperin.net/tag/agobard-of-lyon/
Of course the story is incomplete without its alternate ending involving, you guessed it, the alleged aeronauts getting stoned by townsfolk. The author of the Mysterious Universe article compiling the airship stories also finally admits how difficult finding the truth is.
“While most assume that Agobard is claiming to have he stepped in and used his influence to prevent their deaths, some accounts maintain that they were executed all the same , which just goes to show how difficult it is to wrestle the truth from these antiquated accounts.”
http://mysteriousuniverse.org/2011/09/anchors-aweigh-sky-ships-and-storm-wizards/
David Halperin, a UFO investigator, ties this event with Agobard to another much later event from the 1700’s involving a Turkish, Jewish cult leader. He claims that it was nearly identical to the Agobard event and concludes that they had little to do with space men and more to do with psychological Jungian archetypes (which aren’t without their own faults) and/or spiritual encounters.
http://www.davidhalperin.net/the-mystery-men-of-magonia/
http://www.davidhalperin.net/more-on-the-magonia-men-and-woman/
http://www.davidhalperin.net/the-magonian-quaternity/
Moving back to Gervase of Tilbury’s account. As stated before Gervase seems to have used his “sky sailor” story as proof of a sea in the sky, and of course Ancient Aliens figures this was old time spacemen and that the sea was space.
Certainly, if the ancient astronaut theorists people want to use that story as proof, given its faults as a non-isolated incident, they can. If they do so, then they must also take into account with equal authority the second account mentioned by Gervase as he gives it equal validity to the Bristol event. On Page 13 of Curiosities of Indo-European Tradition and Folk-lore a sailor from Bristol, England dropped his knife overboard into the sea. Lo and behold, his knife then miraculously fell through a skylight in his home and onto his dinner table much to the shock of his wife.
(http://books.google.com/books?id=STneDBrPL0QC&printsec=copyright&dq=agobard+of+Lyon+AND+Magonia&lr=#PPP3,M1)
Perhaps the ancient astronaut theorists would also like to include the following accounts as well. After all, they are also in the Otia Imperialia.
Gervase is thus an important source for medieval English folklore. He gives a Gloucestershire variant of the tale of the stolen fairy goblet (cf. Willy Howe); he describes little working goblins in patched clothes, who are generally helpful but also lead travellers astray—clearly akin to Puck and pixies; he tells of a swineherd who entered the Peak cavern and reached a pleasant Otherworld where harvesting was in progress, though in the human world it was winter. He has heard of Arthur's Knights as a ghostly Wild Hunt, and of a demonic hound with fiery jaws appearing during a thunderstorm in a forest near Penrith.
http://www.answers.com/topic/gervase-of-tilbury
Given that Gervase believed that his accounts proved that there was a literal sea higher up than the ground, using it as proof of ancient astronauts hardly makes it a trustworthy piece of evidence. Especially in light of the fact that nearly the exact same story supposedly happened in so many places throughout different times. There are no less than three events involving the identical story and an additional story or two that are similar enough to raise an eyebrow. The three that are near identical even end in much the same way, even up to the inclusion of the left-behind anchor being used as metalwork for the church. And why would a UFO/alien craft use a contemporary anchor in the first place?
Either these sea-sky pilots have bad luck losing their anchors and sailors at churches and forget their protective suit, or a popular tall-tale it eventually made its rounds through the continent.
Wednesday, May 23, 2012
Flights of Fancy: Debunking Ancient Aliens' Claim of Ancient Flight
In September, Chris White (Revelations Radio Network) will be presenting a video debunking the claims of the Ancient Aliens TV series. In doing this, he put out a call for researchers to help compile the refutations as it really is a huge and daunting project.
Answering the call to join the Christian Justice League, I will share some of the research that I provided. This information will be available in the associated Wiki once the film is released along with the research that other folks provided.
Here's the trailer:
http://conspiracyclothes.com/nowheretorun/video-only-ancient-aliens-debunked-trailer/
and here's the first claim that i took a look at: Ancient flight via the saqqara bird and gold figures of South America. Georgio, that's a nice fish pin that you wear on the show.
Saqqara bird
Claim:
“They are not representing birds, but aircraft.”
“The wings are clearly not bird wings.”
Refutation:
(pictures are available by clicking on the links)
The first claim we’ll look at is that the saqqara bird is not representing a bird, but an aircraft. If they are not representing a bird, why give it a bird-shaped head? Why give it eyes? Both of which are highly obvious in the below photos. If it’s the model of life-sized glide, why is their no cockpit present in the saqqara bird?
Today, we do have aircraft that implement an animal face on the plane or unusual nose art, but that added décor never changes the shape of the aircraft. If the saqqara bird represents an aircraft and not a bird, why make nose of the plane bird-like?
The claim that the wings are not bird’s wings doesn’t necessarily prove they are airplane wings either. The face, while a bird’s face is somewhat simplified, or stylized one could expect the same in regards to the wings.
Furthermore, the wings are not uniform. Martin Gregorie, a model airplane enthusiast, concluded
“the original bird's wings are of unequal length and are not level with the rest of the body and the vertical tail is actually set at an angle.”
http://skippytheskeptic.blogspot.com/2010/07/shooting-down-saqqara-bird.html?m=1
http://www.dumbassguide.info/blog.php?bid=92
https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEhr7A0QqR-OX2ceHpDQecOHfiFBA5hisT5DCj3ZYuYZ8jiVhr3dh-7gMf7A7M8DxuH2Lsa2wG_3ltR4mKR4G557DnLutpeBU3FRLy04ExPZAsMnBMA6Bubu_UrRVnr2WwxjCEK7SqF1JuI/
Claim:
“It’s a very Modern aerodynamic design”
“It is a highly developed glider. This is the design we use today.”
Refutation:
If you see the above picture, the bird “glider” is very thick. Very heavy looking. If the saqqara bird is representing a glider, then this design is not terribly aerodynamic, or modern. Modern gliders are very thin. This is very likely to reduce drag. The more plane there is, the more drag there is and the less flight time there will be.
“Sports gliders benefit from creating the least drag for any given amount of lift, and this is best achieved with long, thin wings and a fully faired narrow cockpit. Aircraft with these features are able to climb efficiently in rising air and can glide long distances at high speed with a minimum loss of height in between.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glider_(sailplane)
If the saqqara bird is using modern design and is a glider, why is there so much surface area?
Even in modern glider designs that don’t incorporate the minimalist designs, the wings are largely exaggerated to reduce the rate of sinking once the craft is in the air.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microlift_glider
Claim:
“The chips on the tail, possibly indicate an elevator had been present.”
Refutation:
The chips on the tail are on only one side of the tail. If a tail had broken off, one would expect the chips to be on both sides and of larger size. Take a look at the chips from the history channel special. Then, my crude snapshot of the other side as it was presented on the Ancient Aliens. Notice, there do not appear to be any chips on the other side of the tale. You may have to see it in the show for yourself, but there are no chips on the other side.
Claim:
“Scale model, they put it into a wind tunnel. Tests show it would fly.”
“The only thing missing and preventing flight, is lack of an elevator rear stabilizing rudder.”
Refutation:
In the “Ancient Aliens” special, in order to get the saqqara bird to be air worthy, they had to add a tale to stabilize the craft. However, merely adding a tail is not enough to make this bird fly.
Here are some quotes from articles that have picked that theory apart.
"Wow - those guys put a model of the bird through a wind tunnel AND a computer simulation and they say it can fly! That's conclusive proof, right? Wrong. Watch the video again and pay attention - these guys aren't testing the Saqqara Bird, they're testing a balsa wood model fitted with a large horizontal tail surface. The real bird has no horizontal tail at all and is made from sycamore, which is something like three times as dense as balsa wood. The real conclusion here is that if the Saqqara Bird was made of different material and actually shaped like an airplane, it could fly. How much does that prove?"
"More to the point, a few years ago model airplane enthusiast Martin Gregorie tested the flight capabilities of a model of the Saqqara Bird and his results were far less enthusiastic. Unlike our friends with the History Channel, Gregorie notes that the original bird's wings are of unequal length and are not level with the rest of the body and the vertical tail is actually set at an angle."
http://skippytheskeptic.blogspot.com/2010/07/shooting-down-saqqara-bird.html?m=1
Martin Gregorie, the model airplane enthusiast mentioned earlier, seems to have tried a number of wings and tails in an attempt to make an exact duplicate of the saqqara bird fly. Most of these configurations were unsuccessful. In order to get it to fly, he had to manipulate the tail stabilizer, which the saqqara bird lacks completely.
Below are the results of Gregorie’s flight.
"The model will not fly without a tail or with the scale tail fitted. The result is always a pitch up if the model is launched at its gliding speed and a pitch down if launched faster, followed by a tumbling motion. Adding ballast to the nose to move the balance point forward has no effect. The result is the same with either wing fitted, except that when the scale wing is fitted the model often tumbles laterally as well.
The model does make a splendid weather vane if it is mounted on a pivot set into its belly under the midpoint of the wing."
"Fitting the big tail enables the model to glide. Both wings require up trim on the tail, i.e. the rear of the tail must be raised. The result is a fast, not very flat glide."
Conclusion
"The performance of this model proves conclusively that the Saqqara Bird never flew. It is totally unstable without a tailplane. A cursory inspection of the photos shows that it never had one.
Even after a tailplane was fitted the glide performance was disappointing. The Saqqara Bird was certainly never a test piece for a low speed, cargo carrying aircraft.
The model makes an excellent weather vane. It points directly and steadily into the wind and does not veer from side to side. In my opinion the Saqqara Bird was probably made as a child's toy or a weather vane. As such it is an interesting artifact and is certainly not an example of Pharaonic High-tech or ancient lost knowledge.”
http://www.catchpenny.org/birdtest.html
Another article mentioning Martin Gregorie's Catchpenny article.
http://books.google.com/books?id=awF5hqJpErAC&pg=PA60&lpg=PA60&dq=the+saqqara+bird+never+had+a+tail&source=bl&ots=6D3tefyxIY&sig=073SODak2BKJKPeScUSS2NqDF7c&hl=en&sa=X&ei=XGuAT-StM822twfE3sSdBg&ved=0CDkQ6AEwBA
Claim:
“Used a catapult to launch it. Modern gliders sometimes use a bungee cord.”
“Scientifics of Egyptology told us that such a bird could be launched via catapult.”
Refutation:
The most popular method of glider launch seems to be using a tow plane, then releasing the glider high in the air. Bungee cords are sometimes used to launch gliders, but that was more common in gliding’s early days and less so now.
“Elastic ropes (known as bungees) are occasionally used at some sites to launch gliders from slopes, if there is sufficient wind blowing up the hill. Bungee launching was the predominant method of launching early gliders.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glider_(sailplane)
Launching this glider via ancient catapult seems precarious at best.
“I don't know about you, but I'm picturing some ancient Egyptian screaming his lungs out as his catapult propelled glider hurdles away, spinning head over tail until it smacks into a pyramid. This Dr. Eenboom seriously believes that you could get some sort of controlled lift off using an ancient catapult!
The show, at this point, displays a hokey computer animation of an ancient glider achieving perfect liftoff by this method. That seems extremely unlikely to me. But if anybody out there wants to actually test this and perhaps prove me wrong, why not try doing a small scale experiment? Get yourself a model catapult and a paper airplane... then let me know if you get anywhere with that.
And what exactly are the "scientifics of Egyptology"? “
http://www.dumbassguide.info/blog.php?bid=92
An expert model airplane enthusiast has pretty much proven the saqqara bird to be incapable of flight. Launching it via primitive catapult seems a tad ridiculous in light of the fact that it isn’t even airworthy.
Regarding the science of ancient Egypt. While they did have impressive inventions such as paper and building the pyramids, keep in mind their science was not without faults. If you don’t believe me, let me paraphrase Chuck Missler and advise you to ask your doctor to try one of these medical treatments.
“Practices such as applying cow dung to wounds, ear piercing, tattooing, and chronic ear infections were important factors in developing tetanus.[39] Frank J. Snoek wrote that Egyptian medicine used fly specks, lizard blood, swine teeth, and other such remedies which he believes could have been harmful.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_Egyptian_technology
Claim:
One researcher believes aliens came and gave us technology.
Refutation:
If aliens gave us the technology to make a people-sized saqqara bird, the Egyptians should have asked for their money back since it never flew. For the sake of argument though, even IF the saqqara bird were capable of flight, which it’s not, aliens are not necessary for giving us the technology. The Wright brothers need no introduction, having invented powered flight. They developed their powered plane by trial and error and it was the culmination of a number of gliders. Nowhere in their invention of the airplane was there a need for an alien intervention. In the unlikely event that the Egyptians ever developed air travel, human ingenuity and perseverance go a long way.
It wouldn’t take aliens to tell the Wright brothers to look at all of the attempts at flight that failed and try something else from there. Same thing with the ancient Egyptians. They would have likely used trial and error as well, only they would have been in the beginning stages of any trials.
Claim:
“Philip coppens said “It’s a fact that our ancestors were more intelligent and had more technological capabilities.”
“Graham Hancock: There is a forgotten episode of history. As a species we have amnesia. Ancient times people were visited by beings not of earth and they gave us technologies, etc.”
Refutation:
(NOT Really sure what direction to go here. One could refute this, but their statements are mere opinion backed by little facts.)
The statement that our ancestors were more intelligent and had more technological capabilities is not especially easy to prove or disprove. Indeed, they did build ancient monuments, but this is not necessarily proof of greater intelligence. Earlier, ancient Egyptian medical practices (involving animal parts and excrement) clearly demonstrate a primitive understanding of basic medical facts. If they were more intelligent, why not have more advance medicine?
This is also a claim that ancient astronaut theorists flip-flop on. On one hand, they want us to believe that yes, our ancestors were super advanced and used high technology given to us by aliens. This technology allegedly enabled us to fly, build monuments with lasers and hover technology. But in the next breath, they want us to believe that these same ancestors were too stupid to understand what the aliens were and called them gods and worshipped them. They claim that the technology was understood as magic.
It can’t be both ways. If they were smart enough to use advanced technology, they would understand it wasn’t magic. If we were smarter long ago, the aliens could easily have explained that they were aliens, not gods and our ancestors would have understood.
Graham Hancock’s statement that there is a forgotten episode of history and that we have culturally forgotten is hard to prove or disprove. Just how far back is he talking about? Written records seemingly go back 5,000 – 7,000 years back and this is
The Egyptian history goes back to 3,100 BC (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_ancient_Egypt) that’s about 5,000 years.
Chinese history, one of the most documented cultures goes back to about 7,000 BC. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_China). Some of this is just evidence of farming, while later into the 5,000 – 6,000 BC range, they had their earliest forms of writing. 2,100 BC gives us probably the beginning of actual records for history.
This article gives a basic run down of when written records for a number of cultures began.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_writing
The 3,100 BC date for ancient Egypt fits sort of well with the accepted dating of the pyramids. Not that everything Zahi Hawass or “experts” say should be taken as absolutely true, most of what they say is within a believable scope.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/pyramid/explore/howold.html
They also emphasize that New Agers and others want an older date for pyramids and want alien involvement and so, stretch facts a bit. This author even went to Egypt and studied hoping to find Edgar Cayce’s claims (whatever those were) were true, but has been convinced of a much younger age for the pyramids than most AA proponents want to throw out.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/pyramid/explore/howold2.html
Pre-Colombian Gold Figures
Claim:
Pre-colombia, Tolima made many gold figures. Funerary objects.
They found about a dozen eerily reminiscent of modern fighter jet. (They have components of jets.)
Georgio said some were like modern fighter jets.
Compared to space shuttle, the basic shape is similar. Wing shape is similar.
Refutation:
To best understand what the gold figures found in the Magdalena River valley actually represent, one must understand the culture that made them. The Tolima lived near the Magdalena river, which they relied upon for food and apparently had extensive access to gold.
“the Magdalena valley was inhabited by communities of farmers, goldsmiths and potters. Some of these built their settlements on the broad alluvial terraces that this fast-flowing river formed.”
http://www.banrepcultural.org/gold-museum/tolima-and-the-gold-museum-exhibition
The Tolima eventually stayed in one spot and stopped their nomadic ways for the most part. This allowed them to farm and also take up more complex art forms like pottery and proably more detailed gold work.
“the nomadic groups living along the banks of the middle section of the River Magdalena were still experimenting with tuber and maize crops.”
http://www.banrepcultural.org/gold-museum/pottery-in-the-magdalena-valley
In summary, the Tolima were sort of nomadic, and eventually farmers and artists. Nothing in their lifestyle suggests any needs for airplanes, much less being familiar with the laws of flight. Their lifestyle kept them in close touch with nature (river animals: fish, alligators; jungle animals: insects and bats). As one would expect, the things that impacted their daily life would likely be the focus of their artwork.
And it was.
One common animal depicted in Tolima art is the bat. Preceding Batman by centuries, human figures were made with bat features. By doing this, they felt somehow that humans would obtain the bat-like abilities. In addition to this, regular old bats may have initially inspired the creation of gold animals in the first place.
“The golden bat is known by this name because when its skin comes into contact with pollen, it turns yellow. This fact could have been the inspiration for the examples that are made of high quality gold.”
http://www.banrepcultural.org/gold-museum/man-and-bat
But why do the wings look like aircraft and shuttle wings?
“One might argue that it is impressively aerodynamic, like an airplane. In response i say, are birds not impressively aerodynamic? Isn’t it a simpler assumption to assume that it was modeled after a bird?...the vertically oriented tail at the rear of the bird figurine is not a trait of birds and is the only anomoly present, which like the fish figure’s abnormal horizontal tail and doubled pectoral fins, is easily attributable to the creative liberties taken by the Tolima.”
http://www.squidoo.com/aahc
http://rabbithole2.com/presentation/ancient/ancient_artifacts_that_challenge_modern_archaeology.htm
http://whofortedblog.com/2011/09/17/ancient-alien-aircraft/
And here’s a fighter jet and space shuttle.
Fighter jet
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Dynamics_F-16_Fighting_Falcon
Space shuttle
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_Shuttle
The better question might be, why do only two out of many depict what looks to be aircraft, when the rest are clearly animals?
Why would a culture that makes gold animals randomly put in two aircraft? In the top picture, the closest object seems to be an alligator or similar animal. Which makes sense since they were a regular feature in Tolima life. The rest are probably birds and fish of various sorts.
http://www.ufocasebook.com/ancients/ancientastronautsphotogallery.html
The left most figure could be a stingray.
http://rabbithole2.com/presentation/ancient/ancient_artifacts_that_challenge_modern_archaeology.htm
Many of these animals are hard to identify, but would hardly be airworthy. The reason for this difficulty is that some of the figures are amalgams of multiple animals and heavily stylized.
“Their goldsmiths have left us figures of insects and small animals cast in gold, some fantastic, others naturalistic. There are fish, lizards, crickets or beings that boast features of various species, like the famous "little planes", which have the head and mouth of a jaguar, the wings of a bird and the tail of a fish”
http://www.banrepcultural.org/gold-museum/tolima-and-the-gold-museum-exhibition
The two most famous“airplanes” will be easily explained and actually do have easily explainable animals. More on that later.
With nature playing such a critical role in inspiring Tolima art, it is absurd to assume that something as fanciful as airplanes were being depicted. While the below quote makes some assumptions that may not necessarily be true (the Wright’s flew without sheet metal and the like) but the questions they ask and conclusion are sound. Why didn’t these supposed aircraft leave a large impression than a few figures?
“this idea starts to fall apart as soon as you think of how a South American culture would practically make airplanes.
For one, making the plane itself could be an issue. Metallurgy was not unknown to South American cultures by any means but most objects produced were ornamental or small practical things like knives. For a plane, you’d need to produce sheet metal, screws, have some sort of welding/soldering tools of which, as far as I know, there has been no archaeological evidence of. I’m also not sure how well bronze would work as your main building element since steel didn’t make it to the Americas until Spain brought it along.
An internal combustion engine could also be useful. And what about fuel? Did the peoples of South America have an industrial revolution a thousand years before anyone else? All archaeological evidence seems to point towards no. You’d think that sort of technology would leave a larger mark than some 2 inch gold ornaments.
Landing the plane could also be an issue what with the unpopularity of the wheel in the Americas. Without large draft animals, the wheel never really caught on in Meso/South America. The extreme highs and lows of the area made transport on foot the easiest and quickest way to get from point A to point B. Unless, of course, you were flying your plane that ran on magical fuel with a non-existent engine that could withstand a gliding landing.
Another problem with this entire theory is that all the speculation is centered on just one of the so-called ‘models’. Of the seven that I’ve seen, not one of them is alike. What seem to be jet-like wings on one becomes curved swoops or scalloped edges in another. The pointed beak of the main ‘airplane’ (the one that was scaled up to fly) is the exception rather than the rule with blunt, rounded heads on the rest. To base an entire theory on just the proportions of one of the artifacts isn’t sound. Just because one flew doesn’t mean the others will. Nevermind that a sample size of seven is too small to draw any sort of conclusion anyway (providing another reason for the lack of legitimate knowledge on these artifacts.)”
http://sites.matrix.msu.edu/pseudoarchaeology/2010/10/12/ancient-airplanes-sleep-with-the-fishes/
Keep in mind to make these two “planes” fly, they had to shave off the frills from the wings, get rid of the holes in the wings, add flaps to the wings and add an engine and landing gear.
http://www.squidoo.com/aahc
Appendix:
More examples of other Tolima Gold work. Note a gold bird-like creature in the same vein as the “airplanes.” Also note, that human figures are flat and highy stylized. Using the same logic apllied to the “airplanes” are we to assume that the Tolima were flat or excessively skinny?
http://www.precolumbiangold.com/tolima.htm
“Later, fish, lizards, crickets and fantastic beings in which features of various species were combined were cast in gold. Symmetrical pendants evoke man in different degrees of schematization, while men, bats and feline figures merge in a continuous stream of transformations…the human body is restricted to two dimensions but is set in multiple symmetries.”
http://www.precolumbiangold.com/tolima.htm
The Tolima art was very stylized as evidenced by the human figures in the below links. The second link shows evidence of highly stylized humans that were used in funeral rituals.
http://www.banrep.gov.co/museo/eng/o_tolima.htm
Artwork from the Zenu people for contrast. The Zenu lived on the coast of the ocean while the Tolima lived more south.
http://www.banrep.gov.co/museo/eng/expo_cartagena3.htm
A Zenu cat. It has holes in its back and a dinosaur tail. Just more evidence that artistic liberties were taken with all gold figures in that general area.
http://www.banrepcultural.org/gold-museum/zenu
another photo of the objects
http://www.unsolved-mysteries.info/english/earchiv/e8archivobj001.htm
Claim:
Georgio, not a single insect has it’s wings at the bottom.
Georgio: They have nothing in common with anything similar in nature.
Refutation:
Firstly, neither of the two figures that Georgio thinks are planes are depicting insects. There may be others, but this one may be one of the few actually depicting an insect. Perhaps a moth. Perhaps a bat.
http://sites.matrix.msu.edu/pseudoarchaeology/2010/10/12/ancient-airplanes-sleep-with-the-fishes/
These are the craft that Georgio seems to be referring to.
http://rabbithole2.com/presentation/ancient/ancient_artifacts_that_challenge_modern_archaeology.htm
http://whofortedblog.com/2011/09/17/ancient-alien-aircraft/
And his claim is that they have nothing in common with an animal found in nature.
Alright, let’s play.
One possibility, for the first one is that it’s a Sphingid moth.
http://sites.matrix.msu.edu/pseudoarchaeology/category/student-blog-posts/page/10/
Based on the wing shape, that’s possible. But it does seem that this would be upside down. The head and eyes seem to be here.
What else could it be?
A lithoxus lithoides from Guyana.
“That’s an armored catfish. And what’s that? It’s found on the north coast of South America? In fact, a catfish could easily explain a lot of the features: the upright tail fin, the two bulging eyes on top, the flat underbelly, the “wings” or fins in two pairs along the side.
But hah, the gold artifacts don’t have a dorsal fin, you say? Well, when you commonly see an Plecostomus (“algae eater”) or Loricariidae (catfish) resting on the bottom of a river, its top fin is flat on its body. And for crying out loud; these are very simplified tiny pieces of jewelry!”
http://whofortedblog.com/2011/09/17/ancient-alien-aircraft/
the catfish perhaps fits this one as well, but this guy has another fish that’s a little closer to a match.
A flying fish.
http://images.nationalgeographic.com/wpf/media-live/photos/000/005/cache/flying-fish_526_600x450.jpg
http://lintasportal.blogspot.com/2011/04/amazing-flying-fish-flying-fishs-facts.html
Flying fish live near the coast of Venezuela, somewhat far from the Tolima, however not so far that it would be unbelievable they would know about them.
Although these are highly stylized, we can be sure that they are meant to be real animals. The below figure, while slightly exaggerated seams to represent a real fish. The artist perhaps was depicting a guitar fish and took some liberties in making it.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/u-eet/82214113/
http://www.elasmodiver.com/Sharkive%20images/BowmouthGuitarfish004.jpg
http://www.ufocasebook.com/ancients/ancientastronautsphotogallery.html
The left most figure could be a stingray.
http://rabbithole2.com/presentation/ancient/ancient_artifacts_that_challenge_modern_archaeology.htm
Claim:
Georgio: Pre-colombian culture knew about aerodynamics
2 examples from across the world, that are aerodynamic defies coincidence.
Refutation:
In the overview of the Tolima culture presented earlier, it’s plain to see that they were an agricultural society which relied on the river for much of their livelihood. We also saw that there was little evidence to support them using or needing aircraft for any part of their existence. If they had developed aircraft, why would they make only two models (widely different) among dozens of animals? Where is the other evidence for the use of aircraft? How did they land the planes? Were there hangars?
The evidence that these two “airplanes” are anything but animals, amongst many other animals is overwhelming.
The second claim that two examples of aerodynamic craft from across the world defies coincidence. The saqqara bird was proven to be completely un-airworthy. Comparing the Tolima objects to the Saqqara bird in light of that does nothing for the credibility of this claim.
Despite the fact that neither the Tolima objects nor the saqqara bird are airworthy, they do have a lot in common. Both are representations of animals. Both require extensive modification to be able to fly. And both objects are being used to promote the false claim that the ancients knew how to fly and were given this knowledge by aliens.
Answering the call to join the Christian Justice League, I will share some of the research that I provided. This information will be available in the associated Wiki once the film is released along with the research that other folks provided.
Here's the trailer:
http://conspiracyclothes.com/nowheretorun/video-only-ancient-aliens-debunked-trailer/
and here's the first claim that i took a look at: Ancient flight via the saqqara bird and gold figures of South America. Georgio, that's a nice fish pin that you wear on the show.
Saqqara bird
Claim:
“They are not representing birds, but aircraft.”
“The wings are clearly not bird wings.”
Refutation:
(pictures are available by clicking on the links)
The first claim we’ll look at is that the saqqara bird is not representing a bird, but an aircraft. If they are not representing a bird, why give it a bird-shaped head? Why give it eyes? Both of which are highly obvious in the below photos. If it’s the model of life-sized glide, why is their no cockpit present in the saqqara bird?
Today, we do have aircraft that implement an animal face on the plane or unusual nose art, but that added décor never changes the shape of the aircraft. If the saqqara bird represents an aircraft and not a bird, why make nose of the plane bird-like?
The claim that the wings are not bird’s wings doesn’t necessarily prove they are airplane wings either. The face, while a bird’s face is somewhat simplified, or stylized one could expect the same in regards to the wings.
Furthermore, the wings are not uniform. Martin Gregorie, a model airplane enthusiast, concluded
“the original bird's wings are of unequal length and are not level with the rest of the body and the vertical tail is actually set at an angle.”
http://skippytheskeptic.blogspot.com/2010/07/shooting-down-saqqara-bird.html?m=1
http://www.dumbassguide.info/blog.php?bid=92
https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEhr7A0QqR-OX2ceHpDQecOHfiFBA5hisT5DCj3ZYuYZ8jiVhr3dh-7gMf7A7M8DxuH2Lsa2wG_3ltR4mKR4G557DnLutpeBU3FRLy04ExPZAsMnBMA6Bubu_UrRVnr2WwxjCEK7SqF1JuI/
Claim:
“It’s a very Modern aerodynamic design”
“It is a highly developed glider. This is the design we use today.”
Refutation:
If you see the above picture, the bird “glider” is very thick. Very heavy looking. If the saqqara bird is representing a glider, then this design is not terribly aerodynamic, or modern. Modern gliders are very thin. This is very likely to reduce drag. The more plane there is, the more drag there is and the less flight time there will be.
“Sports gliders benefit from creating the least drag for any given amount of lift, and this is best achieved with long, thin wings and a fully faired narrow cockpit. Aircraft with these features are able to climb efficiently in rising air and can glide long distances at high speed with a minimum loss of height in between.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glider_(sailplane)
If the saqqara bird is using modern design and is a glider, why is there so much surface area?
Even in modern glider designs that don’t incorporate the minimalist designs, the wings are largely exaggerated to reduce the rate of sinking once the craft is in the air.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microlift_glider
Claim:
“The chips on the tail, possibly indicate an elevator had been present.”
Refutation:
The chips on the tail are on only one side of the tail. If a tail had broken off, one would expect the chips to be on both sides and of larger size. Take a look at the chips from the history channel special. Then, my crude snapshot of the other side as it was presented on the Ancient Aliens. Notice, there do not appear to be any chips on the other side of the tale. You may have to see it in the show for yourself, but there are no chips on the other side.
Claim:
“Scale model, they put it into a wind tunnel. Tests show it would fly.”
“The only thing missing and preventing flight, is lack of an elevator rear stabilizing rudder.”
Refutation:
In the “Ancient Aliens” special, in order to get the saqqara bird to be air worthy, they had to add a tale to stabilize the craft. However, merely adding a tail is not enough to make this bird fly.
Here are some quotes from articles that have picked that theory apart.
"Wow - those guys put a model of the bird through a wind tunnel AND a computer simulation and they say it can fly! That's conclusive proof, right? Wrong. Watch the video again and pay attention - these guys aren't testing the Saqqara Bird, they're testing a balsa wood model fitted with a large horizontal tail surface. The real bird has no horizontal tail at all and is made from sycamore, which is something like three times as dense as balsa wood. The real conclusion here is that if the Saqqara Bird was made of different material and actually shaped like an airplane, it could fly. How much does that prove?"
"More to the point, a few years ago model airplane enthusiast Martin Gregorie tested the flight capabilities of a model of the Saqqara Bird and his results were far less enthusiastic. Unlike our friends with the History Channel, Gregorie notes that the original bird's wings are of unequal length and are not level with the rest of the body and the vertical tail is actually set at an angle."
http://skippytheskeptic.blogspot.com/2010/07/shooting-down-saqqara-bird.html?m=1
Martin Gregorie, the model airplane enthusiast mentioned earlier, seems to have tried a number of wings and tails in an attempt to make an exact duplicate of the saqqara bird fly. Most of these configurations were unsuccessful. In order to get it to fly, he had to manipulate the tail stabilizer, which the saqqara bird lacks completely.
Below are the results of Gregorie’s flight.
"The model will not fly without a tail or with the scale tail fitted. The result is always a pitch up if the model is launched at its gliding speed and a pitch down if launched faster, followed by a tumbling motion. Adding ballast to the nose to move the balance point forward has no effect. The result is the same with either wing fitted, except that when the scale wing is fitted the model often tumbles laterally as well.
The model does make a splendid weather vane if it is mounted on a pivot set into its belly under the midpoint of the wing."
"Fitting the big tail enables the model to glide. Both wings require up trim on the tail, i.e. the rear of the tail must be raised. The result is a fast, not very flat glide."
Conclusion
"The performance of this model proves conclusively that the Saqqara Bird never flew. It is totally unstable without a tailplane. A cursory inspection of the photos shows that it never had one.
Even after a tailplane was fitted the glide performance was disappointing. The Saqqara Bird was certainly never a test piece for a low speed, cargo carrying aircraft.
The model makes an excellent weather vane. It points directly and steadily into the wind and does not veer from side to side. In my opinion the Saqqara Bird was probably made as a child's toy or a weather vane. As such it is an interesting artifact and is certainly not an example of Pharaonic High-tech or ancient lost knowledge.”
http://www.catchpenny.org/birdtest.html
Another article mentioning Martin Gregorie's Catchpenny article.
http://books.google.com/books?id=awF5hqJpErAC&pg=PA60&lpg=PA60&dq=the+saqqara+bird+never+had+a+tail&source=bl&ots=6D3tefyxIY&sig=073SODak2BKJKPeScUSS2NqDF7c&hl=en&sa=X&ei=XGuAT-StM822twfE3sSdBg&ved=0CDkQ6AEwBA
Claim:
“Used a catapult to launch it. Modern gliders sometimes use a bungee cord.”
“Scientifics of Egyptology told us that such a bird could be launched via catapult.”
Refutation:
The most popular method of glider launch seems to be using a tow plane, then releasing the glider high in the air. Bungee cords are sometimes used to launch gliders, but that was more common in gliding’s early days and less so now.
“Elastic ropes (known as bungees) are occasionally used at some sites to launch gliders from slopes, if there is sufficient wind blowing up the hill. Bungee launching was the predominant method of launching early gliders.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glider_(sailplane)
Launching this glider via ancient catapult seems precarious at best.
“I don't know about you, but I'm picturing some ancient Egyptian screaming his lungs out as his catapult propelled glider hurdles away, spinning head over tail until it smacks into a pyramid. This Dr. Eenboom seriously believes that you could get some sort of controlled lift off using an ancient catapult!
The show, at this point, displays a hokey computer animation of an ancient glider achieving perfect liftoff by this method. That seems extremely unlikely to me. But if anybody out there wants to actually test this and perhaps prove me wrong, why not try doing a small scale experiment? Get yourself a model catapult and a paper airplane... then let me know if you get anywhere with that.
And what exactly are the "scientifics of Egyptology"? “
http://www.dumbassguide.info/blog.php?bid=92
An expert model airplane enthusiast has pretty much proven the saqqara bird to be incapable of flight. Launching it via primitive catapult seems a tad ridiculous in light of the fact that it isn’t even airworthy.
Regarding the science of ancient Egypt. While they did have impressive inventions such as paper and building the pyramids, keep in mind their science was not without faults. If you don’t believe me, let me paraphrase Chuck Missler and advise you to ask your doctor to try one of these medical treatments.
“Practices such as applying cow dung to wounds, ear piercing, tattooing, and chronic ear infections were important factors in developing tetanus.[39] Frank J. Snoek wrote that Egyptian medicine used fly specks, lizard blood, swine teeth, and other such remedies which he believes could have been harmful.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_Egyptian_technology
Claim:
One researcher believes aliens came and gave us technology.
Refutation:
If aliens gave us the technology to make a people-sized saqqara bird, the Egyptians should have asked for their money back since it never flew. For the sake of argument though, even IF the saqqara bird were capable of flight, which it’s not, aliens are not necessary for giving us the technology. The Wright brothers need no introduction, having invented powered flight. They developed their powered plane by trial and error and it was the culmination of a number of gliders. Nowhere in their invention of the airplane was there a need for an alien intervention. In the unlikely event that the Egyptians ever developed air travel, human ingenuity and perseverance go a long way.
It wouldn’t take aliens to tell the Wright brothers to look at all of the attempts at flight that failed and try something else from there. Same thing with the ancient Egyptians. They would have likely used trial and error as well, only they would have been in the beginning stages of any trials.
Claim:
“Philip coppens said “It’s a fact that our ancestors were more intelligent and had more technological capabilities.”
“Graham Hancock: There is a forgotten episode of history. As a species we have amnesia. Ancient times people were visited by beings not of earth and they gave us technologies, etc.”
Refutation:
(NOT Really sure what direction to go here. One could refute this, but their statements are mere opinion backed by little facts.)
The statement that our ancestors were more intelligent and had more technological capabilities is not especially easy to prove or disprove. Indeed, they did build ancient monuments, but this is not necessarily proof of greater intelligence. Earlier, ancient Egyptian medical practices (involving animal parts and excrement) clearly demonstrate a primitive understanding of basic medical facts. If they were more intelligent, why not have more advance medicine?
This is also a claim that ancient astronaut theorists flip-flop on. On one hand, they want us to believe that yes, our ancestors were super advanced and used high technology given to us by aliens. This technology allegedly enabled us to fly, build monuments with lasers and hover technology. But in the next breath, they want us to believe that these same ancestors were too stupid to understand what the aliens were and called them gods and worshipped them. They claim that the technology was understood as magic.
It can’t be both ways. If they were smart enough to use advanced technology, they would understand it wasn’t magic. If we were smarter long ago, the aliens could easily have explained that they were aliens, not gods and our ancestors would have understood.
Graham Hancock’s statement that there is a forgotten episode of history and that we have culturally forgotten is hard to prove or disprove. Just how far back is he talking about? Written records seemingly go back 5,000 – 7,000 years back and this is
The Egyptian history goes back to 3,100 BC (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_ancient_Egypt) that’s about 5,000 years.
Chinese history, one of the most documented cultures goes back to about 7,000 BC. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_China). Some of this is just evidence of farming, while later into the 5,000 – 6,000 BC range, they had their earliest forms of writing. 2,100 BC gives us probably the beginning of actual records for history.
This article gives a basic run down of when written records for a number of cultures began.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_writing
The 3,100 BC date for ancient Egypt fits sort of well with the accepted dating of the pyramids. Not that everything Zahi Hawass or “experts” say should be taken as absolutely true, most of what they say is within a believable scope.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/pyramid/explore/howold.html
They also emphasize that New Agers and others want an older date for pyramids and want alien involvement and so, stretch facts a bit. This author even went to Egypt and studied hoping to find Edgar Cayce’s claims (whatever those were) were true, but has been convinced of a much younger age for the pyramids than most AA proponents want to throw out.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/pyramid/explore/howold2.html
Pre-Colombian Gold Figures
Claim:
Pre-colombia, Tolima made many gold figures. Funerary objects.
They found about a dozen eerily reminiscent of modern fighter jet. (They have components of jets.)
Georgio said some were like modern fighter jets.
Compared to space shuttle, the basic shape is similar. Wing shape is similar.
Refutation:
To best understand what the gold figures found in the Magdalena River valley actually represent, one must understand the culture that made them. The Tolima lived near the Magdalena river, which they relied upon for food and apparently had extensive access to gold.
“the Magdalena valley was inhabited by communities of farmers, goldsmiths and potters. Some of these built their settlements on the broad alluvial terraces that this fast-flowing river formed.”
http://www.banrepcultural.org/gold-museum/tolima-and-the-gold-museum-exhibition
The Tolima eventually stayed in one spot and stopped their nomadic ways for the most part. This allowed them to farm and also take up more complex art forms like pottery and proably more detailed gold work.
“the nomadic groups living along the banks of the middle section of the River Magdalena were still experimenting with tuber and maize crops.”
http://www.banrepcultural.org/gold-museum/pottery-in-the-magdalena-valley
In summary, the Tolima were sort of nomadic, and eventually farmers and artists. Nothing in their lifestyle suggests any needs for airplanes, much less being familiar with the laws of flight. Their lifestyle kept them in close touch with nature (river animals: fish, alligators; jungle animals: insects and bats). As one would expect, the things that impacted their daily life would likely be the focus of their artwork.
And it was.
One common animal depicted in Tolima art is the bat. Preceding Batman by centuries, human figures were made with bat features. By doing this, they felt somehow that humans would obtain the bat-like abilities. In addition to this, regular old bats may have initially inspired the creation of gold animals in the first place.
“The golden bat is known by this name because when its skin comes into contact with pollen, it turns yellow. This fact could have been the inspiration for the examples that are made of high quality gold.”
http://www.banrepcultural.org/gold-museum/man-and-bat
But why do the wings look like aircraft and shuttle wings?
“One might argue that it is impressively aerodynamic, like an airplane. In response i say, are birds not impressively aerodynamic? Isn’t it a simpler assumption to assume that it was modeled after a bird?...the vertically oriented tail at the rear of the bird figurine is not a trait of birds and is the only anomoly present, which like the fish figure’s abnormal horizontal tail and doubled pectoral fins, is easily attributable to the creative liberties taken by the Tolima.”
http://www.squidoo.com/aahc
http://rabbithole2.com/presentation/ancient/ancient_artifacts_that_challenge_modern_archaeology.htm
http://whofortedblog.com/2011/09/17/ancient-alien-aircraft/
And here’s a fighter jet and space shuttle.
Fighter jet
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Dynamics_F-16_Fighting_Falcon
Space shuttle
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_Shuttle
The better question might be, why do only two out of many depict what looks to be aircraft, when the rest are clearly animals?
Why would a culture that makes gold animals randomly put in two aircraft? In the top picture, the closest object seems to be an alligator or similar animal. Which makes sense since they were a regular feature in Tolima life. The rest are probably birds and fish of various sorts.
http://www.ufocasebook.com/ancients/ancientastronautsphotogallery.html
The left most figure could be a stingray.
http://rabbithole2.com/presentation/ancient/ancient_artifacts_that_challenge_modern_archaeology.htm
Many of these animals are hard to identify, but would hardly be airworthy. The reason for this difficulty is that some of the figures are amalgams of multiple animals and heavily stylized.
“Their goldsmiths have left us figures of insects and small animals cast in gold, some fantastic, others naturalistic. There are fish, lizards, crickets or beings that boast features of various species, like the famous "little planes", which have the head and mouth of a jaguar, the wings of a bird and the tail of a fish”
http://www.banrepcultural.org/gold-museum/tolima-and-the-gold-museum-exhibition
The two most famous“airplanes” will be easily explained and actually do have easily explainable animals. More on that later.
With nature playing such a critical role in inspiring Tolima art, it is absurd to assume that something as fanciful as airplanes were being depicted. While the below quote makes some assumptions that may not necessarily be true (the Wright’s flew without sheet metal and the like) but the questions they ask and conclusion are sound. Why didn’t these supposed aircraft leave a large impression than a few figures?
“this idea starts to fall apart as soon as you think of how a South American culture would practically make airplanes.
For one, making the plane itself could be an issue. Metallurgy was not unknown to South American cultures by any means but most objects produced were ornamental or small practical things like knives. For a plane, you’d need to produce sheet metal, screws, have some sort of welding/soldering tools of which, as far as I know, there has been no archaeological evidence of. I’m also not sure how well bronze would work as your main building element since steel didn’t make it to the Americas until Spain brought it along.
An internal combustion engine could also be useful. And what about fuel? Did the peoples of South America have an industrial revolution a thousand years before anyone else? All archaeological evidence seems to point towards no. You’d think that sort of technology would leave a larger mark than some 2 inch gold ornaments.
Landing the plane could also be an issue what with the unpopularity of the wheel in the Americas. Without large draft animals, the wheel never really caught on in Meso/South America. The extreme highs and lows of the area made transport on foot the easiest and quickest way to get from point A to point B. Unless, of course, you were flying your plane that ran on magical fuel with a non-existent engine that could withstand a gliding landing.
Another problem with this entire theory is that all the speculation is centered on just one of the so-called ‘models’. Of the seven that I’ve seen, not one of them is alike. What seem to be jet-like wings on one becomes curved swoops or scalloped edges in another. The pointed beak of the main ‘airplane’ (the one that was scaled up to fly) is the exception rather than the rule with blunt, rounded heads on the rest. To base an entire theory on just the proportions of one of the artifacts isn’t sound. Just because one flew doesn’t mean the others will. Nevermind that a sample size of seven is too small to draw any sort of conclusion anyway (providing another reason for the lack of legitimate knowledge on these artifacts.)”
http://sites.matrix.msu.edu/pseudoarchaeology/2010/10/12/ancient-airplanes-sleep-with-the-fishes/
Keep in mind to make these two “planes” fly, they had to shave off the frills from the wings, get rid of the holes in the wings, add flaps to the wings and add an engine and landing gear.
http://www.squidoo.com/aahc
Appendix:
More examples of other Tolima Gold work. Note a gold bird-like creature in the same vein as the “airplanes.” Also note, that human figures are flat and highy stylized. Using the same logic apllied to the “airplanes” are we to assume that the Tolima were flat or excessively skinny?
http://www.precolumbiangold.com/tolima.htm
“Later, fish, lizards, crickets and fantastic beings in which features of various species were combined were cast in gold. Symmetrical pendants evoke man in different degrees of schematization, while men, bats and feline figures merge in a continuous stream of transformations…the human body is restricted to two dimensions but is set in multiple symmetries.”
http://www.precolumbiangold.com/tolima.htm
The Tolima art was very stylized as evidenced by the human figures in the below links. The second link shows evidence of highly stylized humans that were used in funeral rituals.
http://www.banrep.gov.co/museo/eng/o_tolima.htm
Artwork from the Zenu people for contrast. The Zenu lived on the coast of the ocean while the Tolima lived more south.
http://www.banrep.gov.co/museo/eng/expo_cartagena3.htm
A Zenu cat. It has holes in its back and a dinosaur tail. Just more evidence that artistic liberties were taken with all gold figures in that general area.
http://www.banrepcultural.org/gold-museum/zenu
another photo of the objects
http://www.unsolved-mysteries.info/english/earchiv/e8archivobj001.htm
Claim:
Georgio, not a single insect has it’s wings at the bottom.
Georgio: They have nothing in common with anything similar in nature.
Refutation:
Firstly, neither of the two figures that Georgio thinks are planes are depicting insects. There may be others, but this one may be one of the few actually depicting an insect. Perhaps a moth. Perhaps a bat.
http://sites.matrix.msu.edu/pseudoarchaeology/2010/10/12/ancient-airplanes-sleep-with-the-fishes/
These are the craft that Georgio seems to be referring to.
http://rabbithole2.com/presentation/ancient/ancient_artifacts_that_challenge_modern_archaeology.htm
http://whofortedblog.com/2011/09/17/ancient-alien-aircraft/
And his claim is that they have nothing in common with an animal found in nature.
Alright, let’s play.
One possibility, for the first one is that it’s a Sphingid moth.
http://sites.matrix.msu.edu/pseudoarchaeology/category/student-blog-posts/page/10/
Based on the wing shape, that’s possible. But it does seem that this would be upside down. The head and eyes seem to be here.
What else could it be?
A lithoxus lithoides from Guyana.
“That’s an armored catfish. And what’s that? It’s found on the north coast of South America? In fact, a catfish could easily explain a lot of the features: the upright tail fin, the two bulging eyes on top, the flat underbelly, the “wings” or fins in two pairs along the side.
But hah, the gold artifacts don’t have a dorsal fin, you say? Well, when you commonly see an Plecostomus (“algae eater”) or Loricariidae (catfish) resting on the bottom of a river, its top fin is flat on its body. And for crying out loud; these are very simplified tiny pieces of jewelry!”
http://whofortedblog.com/2011/09/17/ancient-alien-aircraft/
the catfish perhaps fits this one as well, but this guy has another fish that’s a little closer to a match.
A flying fish.
http://images.nationalgeographic.com/wpf/media-live/photos/000/005/cache/flying-fish_526_600x450.jpg
http://lintasportal.blogspot.com/2011/04/amazing-flying-fish-flying-fishs-facts.html
Flying fish live near the coast of Venezuela, somewhat far from the Tolima, however not so far that it would be unbelievable they would know about them.
Although these are highly stylized, we can be sure that they are meant to be real animals. The below figure, while slightly exaggerated seams to represent a real fish. The artist perhaps was depicting a guitar fish and took some liberties in making it.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/u-eet/82214113/
http://www.elasmodiver.com/Sharkive%20images/BowmouthGuitarfish004.jpg
http://www.ufocasebook.com/ancients/ancientastronautsphotogallery.html
The left most figure could be a stingray.
http://rabbithole2.com/presentation/ancient/ancient_artifacts_that_challenge_modern_archaeology.htm
Claim:
Georgio: Pre-colombian culture knew about aerodynamics
2 examples from across the world, that are aerodynamic defies coincidence.
Refutation:
In the overview of the Tolima culture presented earlier, it’s plain to see that they were an agricultural society which relied on the river for much of their livelihood. We also saw that there was little evidence to support them using or needing aircraft for any part of their existence. If they had developed aircraft, why would they make only two models (widely different) among dozens of animals? Where is the other evidence for the use of aircraft? How did they land the planes? Were there hangars?
The evidence that these two “airplanes” are anything but animals, amongst many other animals is overwhelming.
The second claim that two examples of aerodynamic craft from across the world defies coincidence. The saqqara bird was proven to be completely un-airworthy. Comparing the Tolima objects to the Saqqara bird in light of that does nothing for the credibility of this claim.
Despite the fact that neither the Tolima objects nor the saqqara bird are airworthy, they do have a lot in common. Both are representations of animals. Both require extensive modification to be able to fly. And both objects are being used to promote the false claim that the ancients knew how to fly and were given this knowledge by aliens.
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